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To: mitch5501; 1010RD
I personally believe that the story Jesus told reagrding the rich man and Lazarus the beggar is a huge clue. Lazarus is said to have died and been transported to a place described as 'Abraham's bosom', with a great gulf fixed separating that place of comforting from a place of torment where the rich man was transported.

Curiously, a place of comforting would not be too comforable if from that place one could look over to the place where people are in torment, so I conclude that though the rich man could see Lazarus being comforted, Lazarus would not have seen the rich man being tormented.

The place of torment is so bad that the rich man asks to have Lazarus sent from thence to warn the rich man's kin so that they repent and not end up where he is! The Lord responds that even if one returned from the dead to testify, since for their lifetimes they had the witness of the law and the prophets they would not repent even for the witness of one returned from the dead to warn them ... and Jesus was only weeks away from returning from that place of comforting to witness to all of humankind that there is resurrection from death through Him. The New Testament relates to us that during the three days He was physically dead, Jesus witnessed to those in that place of comforting and that these He will bring with Him upon His return to claim His Church and the witnesses who will witness the marriage of the Lamb.

Addressing the notion that Jesus was not yet ascended into Heaven when He related to the thief on the cross next to Him, 'Today thou shalt be with me in paradise', when Jesus died His human soul and spirit were transported to the place Lazarus had been transported to. From thence the thief would be transported to Heaven when Jesus brings the souls of the saved with Him.

The thief was as saved as Lazarus the instant Jesus told him he would be with Him in Paradise. The thief had no baptism. The thief fulfilled no temple ordinances. The thief had no lifetime of striving to keep the commandments. BUT the thief did the thing Jesus tells us was required by God to obtain deliverance: the thief believed on Him WHom God sent as Soter, Deliverer. Believing on Him is the work God requires for salvation. And that day, the thief did the work that God requires.

136 posted on 09/30/2010 8:19:35 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Dems, believing they cannot be deceived, it's nye impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: MHGinTN
That's an creative interpretation of the story.

What interests me most, though, is your interpretation of this:

BUT the thief did the thing Jesus tells us was required by God to obtain deliverance: the thief believed on Him WHom God sent as Soter, Deliverer. Believing on Him is the work God requires for salvation. And that day, the thief did the work that God requires.

Please, walk me through that verse so I can understand better why you see it that way.

308 posted on 09/30/2010 6:06:47 PM PDT by 1010RD (First Do No Harm)
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