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To: markomalley

Is the orthodoxy of one’s Roman Catholicism now measured in this country by where one falls on a political spectrum?

I was recently with an Orthodox hierarch (a real conservative) and a group of clergy and laity. When the discussion turned to a possible reunion of Rome with the Orthodox churches, one of the main concerns expressed by the participants was the, to us, incredible politicization of Roman Catholicism and the Roman Catholic Church in America.


4 posted on 09/27/2010 6:30:21 AM PDT by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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To: Kolokotronis
Is the orthodoxy of one’s Roman Catholicism now measured in this country by where one falls on a political spectrum?

No, orthodoxy is orthodoxy, and it shouldn't be measured by a political system. Many Catholics are falling into this error. Catholics aligning themselves with certain political parties or movements is fine for politics but when we are talking about God, The Church, The Mass, let us all be orthodox.

8 posted on 09/27/2010 6:47:14 AM PDT by frogjerk (I believe in unicorns, fairies and pro-life Democrats.)
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To: Kolokotronis
Is the orthodoxy of one’s Roman Catholicism now measured in this country by where one falls on a political spectrum?

With several notable exceptions, unfortunately that is the basic consensus among the US bishops. And the place that the truly "orthodox" fall is to the hard left -- which, of course, means that I am a dissenter (in their eyes).

There are notable exceptions: Archbishop Chaput is a big one; Archbishop Nienstedt; Bishop Finn; Bishop Slattery. And others. But they are still in the minority.

A big part of the problem is the curia within the USCCB. I posted an article a few days ago that highlighted the problems with it and it is not likely to change anytime soon.

A big part of the problem is that the USCCB bureaucrats are putting out half-teachings, particularly on social issues. Take, for example, this document, which was published in many church bulletins this week. This document outlines the following themes (if you wish to read the description of each "theme", you should click on the link above):

The problem is that this is not what the Catholic Church teaches.

What the Church teaches is this:

160. The permanent principles of the Church's social doctrine [ 341] constitute the very heart of Catholic social teaching. These are the principles of: the dignity of the human person, which has already been dealt with in the preceding chapter, and which is the foundation of all the other principles and content of the Church's social doctrine; [342] the common good; subsidiarity; and solidarity.

Or to outline it:

Everything else (family, work, environment, etc.) are applied within the above framework and hang off from one or more of the above principles and must be applied in light of those principles (with respect to the values of truth, freedom, and justice as well)

But unfortunately, you don't hear that out of the USCCB -- you get those seven squishy, politically correct "themes."

Now most priests and deacons don't really study social doctrine that intently in their formation process...and, it is rare to hear of anything other than a class being given by an ultraleftist training them in their one class on social doctrine. Consequently, the myth propagates.

And then, when you have a conservative bishop who actually understands social doctrine...his impact is minimized.

So yes, unfortunately, there is a political "orthodoxy" in our hierarchy. I think it is gradually changing...but I sure could go for a far faster change in this department. If, for no other reason, I hate continually being in a position of being required to be a dissenter to my own bishop as a condition to being faithful to the teachings of the Church.

15 posted on 09/27/2010 7:09:11 AM PDT by markomalley (Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus)
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To: Kolokotronis
Is the orthodoxy of one’s Roman Catholicism now measured in this country by where one falls on a political spectrum?

No, but a certain political party to which most cradle Catholics have traditionally belonged (as a convert, I don't have this cultural baggage) has become a fanatical proponent of the culture of death, including promotion of abortion and homosexual activity, so I think that it is incumbent upon the hierarchy to speak up for Catholic moral principles, whether fashionable or not. It is not a matter of partisanship, but standing up for what is right against moral heresy. They could criticize similar tendencies on the other political side as well if they want to appear "balanced". This is the era of moral heresy above all else.

24 posted on 09/27/2010 9:33:19 AM PDT by Unam Sanctam
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