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To: Iscool; D-fendr
"That we should be to the praise of His glory who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also AFTER THAT YE BELIEVED YE WERE SEALED with that Holy Spirit of promise." (Ephesians 1:12, 13).

"And grieve not the Holy Spirit of God, whereby YE ARE SEALED UNTO THE DAY OF REDEMPTION." (Eph. 4:30).

Believers are sealed by the Holy Spirt at the moment of salvation. We are sealed unto the day of redemption. Meaning, we cannot unseal anything. It's there, until it is redeemed. By Christ. We are His.

7,336 posted on 08/06/2010 5:07:23 PM PDT by smvoice (smvoice- formally known as small voice in the wilderness. Easier on the typing!)
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To: smvoice
Believers are sealed

Believers in what precisely? And how much belief, under what tests and for how long?

We don't know our future and we judge ourselves in these matters, Jesus does.

7,343 posted on 08/06/2010 5:20:30 PM PDT by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: smvoice
Sorry, obviously, should have typed:

We don't know our future and we don't judge ourselves in these matters, Jesus does.

7,346 posted on 08/06/2010 5:25:59 PM PDT by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: smvoice
"Believers are sealed by the Holy Spirt at the moment of salvation. We are sealed unto the day of redemption. Meaning, we cannot unseal anything. It's there, until it is redeemed. By Christ. We are His."

Clearly, the verses being used are there to address fears that someone or something outside can affect our relationship with Christ. Nothing that someone or something else does can affect our relationship with Christ. This is superior to the Moslem faith where e.g., you can lose 'heaven' if you are buried covered in pig offal.

It is also just as clear that we can walk away from our salvation.

Hebrews 6:3-6 - "It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace."

Matthew 7:21 - "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven."

Taking verses out-of-context doesn't help believers understand their true standing. Invoking the 'well they weren't really saved anyway' argument doesn't help either. It just turns your argument into a fallacy. Better to face the truth that you can (and some will) lose their salvation by turning away from the truth. Grow up, please.

7,382 posted on 08/07/2010 7:22:16 AM PDT by GourmetDan (Eccl 10:2 - The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left.)
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