What was this thread started as but demonizing an opponent and telling them to shut up. If you cant see your side doing the same thing you are accusing me of, then there is really no reason for discussion with you.
And no one is trying to shut you up. Just wondering why this small group only seems concerned with pointing out the faults of Mormons.
Just wondering why someone can't see the posts are pointing out the faults of mormonISM. Also wondering why someone would spend so much time trying to figure out motives for posts made by other FReepers...didn't someone on this thread suggest there are many other more important happenings to spend bandwidth on?
It would follow that there are many more important things than whether two or three threads in the Religion Forum don't fit someone's approval.
Something to chew on...The mormon "Plan of Salvation"
Premortal Life
Before we were born on the earth, we lived in the presence of our Heavenly Father as one of His spirit children. In this premortal existence, we attended a council with Heavenly Father's other spirit children. At that council, Heavenly Father presented His great plan of happiness (see Abraham 3:22–26).
In harmony with the plan of happiness, the premortal Jesus Christ, the Firstborn Son of the Father in the spirit, covenanted to be the Savior (see Moses 4:2; Abraham 3:27). Those who followed Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ were permitted to come to the earth to experience mortality and progress toward eternal life. Lucifer, another spirit son of God, rebelled against the plan and "sought to destroy the agency of man" (Moses 4:3). He became Satan, and he and his followers were cast out of heaven and denied the privileges of receiving a physical body and experiencing mortality (see Moses 4:4; Abraham 3:27–28).
Throughout our premortal lives, we developed our identity and increased our spiritual capabilities. Blessed with the gift of agency, we made important decisions, such as the decision to follow Heavenly Father's plan. These decisions affected our life then and now. We grew in intelligence and learned to love the truth, and we prepared to come to the earth, where we could continue to progress.
Mortal Life
We are now experiencing mortal life. Our spirits are united with our bodies, giving us opportunities to grow and develop in ways that were not possible in premortal life. This part of our existence is a time of learning in which we can prove ourselves, choose to come unto Christ, and prepare to be worthy of eternal life. It is also a time when we can help others find the truth and gain a testimony of the plan of salvation.
Life after Death
When we die, our spirits will enter the spirit world and await the resurrection. At the time of the resurrection, our spirit and body will reunite, and we will be judged and received into a kingdom of glory. The glory we inherit will depend on the depth of our conversion and our obedience to the Lord's commandments (see Kingdoms of Glory). It will depend on the manner in which we have "received the testimony of Jesus" (D&C 76:51; see also D&C 76:74, 79, 101).
Perdition and the Three Degrees of Glory
Doctrine and Covenants 76:30-112; 131:1-4
|
Eternal Habitation |
Verse |
Actions/Works |
Consequences |
|
Perdition (no Kingdom or Glory) |
31 |
Known & partaken of God’s power |
|
|
31 |
Suffered selves to be overcome by devil |
|
|
|
31 |
Deny the truth and defy God’s power |
|
|
|
33 |
|
Vessels of wrath |
|
|
33 |
|
Doomed to suffer wrath of God |
|
|
34 |
|
No forgiveness in this world/world to come |
|
|
35 |
Denied Holy Spirit after receiving it |
|
|
|
35 |
Denied Only Begotten Son |
|
|
|
35 |
Crucified Son unto themselves, to an open shame |
|
|
|
36 |
|
Go into lake of fire/brimstone w/ devil and angels |
|
|
37 |
|
Only ones whom second death shall have any power |
|
|
38 |
|
Not be redeemed in due time of the Lord |
|
|
48 |
|
The end, width, height, depth and misery none understand |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Celestial Kingdom |
51 |
Received testimony of Jesus |
|
|
51 |
Believed in Christ’s name |
|
|
|
51 |
Baptized in water in his name |
|
|
|
52 |
Keep commandments |
|
|
|
52 |
|
Washed and cleanses from sins |
|
|
52 |
Receive the Holy Spirit by laying on of hands by one ordained |
|
|
|
52, 53 |
Sealed by power of the Spirit |
|
|
|
53 |
Overcome by faith |
|
|
|
53 |
|
Holy Spirit shed on them |
|
|
54 |
|
The Church of the Firstborn |
|
|
55 |
|
Father gives all things into their hands |
|
|
56 |
|
Are priests and kings |
|
|
56 |
|
Received of God’s fullness and glory |
|
|
57 |
|
Priests after the order of the Only Begotten Son |
|
|
58 |
|
They are gods/sons of God |
|
|
59 |
|
All things are theirs |
|
|
60 |
|
Shall overcome all things |
|
|
62 |
|
Shall dwell in God’s and Christ’s presence forever |
|
|
63 |
|
Shall come with Christ to reign over the earth |
|
|
64 |
|
Have part in the first resurrection |
|
|
65 |
|
Come forth in resurrection of the just |
|
|
66 |
|
Have come unto Mount Zion, city of living God, holiest of all |
|
|
67 |
|
Come to general assembly and church of Enoch/Firstborn |
|
|
68 |
|
Names written in heaven |
|
|
69 |
|
Are just men made perfect through Jesus |
|
|
70 |
|
Bodies are celestial, glory as the glory of God |
|
|
131:2 |
Enter the new and everlasting covenant of marriage |
Enter into highest heaven/degree in celestial kingdom |
|
|
131:3-4 |
Does not enter into covenant |
Cannot have an increase |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Terrestrial Kingdom |
72 |
Died without the law |
|
|
73 |
Spirits kept in prison |
|
|
|
74 |
Received testimony of Christ in spirit world |
|
|
|
75 |
Honorable men of the earth |
|
|
|
75 |
Blinded by craftiness of men |
|
|
|
76 |
|
Received glory but not fullness |
|
|
77 |
Received presence of Son, but not the Father |
|
|
|
78 |
|
Bodies are terrestrial |
|
|
79 |
Not valiant in the testimony of Jesus |
Obtain not crown over kingdom of God |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Telestial Kingdom |
82 |
Received not gospel of Christ |
|
|
82 |
Received not testimony of Jesus |
|
|
|
83 |
Deny not the Holy Spirit |
|
|
|
84 |
|
Thrust down to hell |
|
|
85 |
|
Not redeemed from devil till Christ has finished his work |
|
|
86 |
Received not of Christ’ fullness in eternal world |
|
|
|
86 |
Received Holy Spirit through ministration of the terrestrial |
|
|
|
88 |
Receive the administering of angels |
|
|
|
88 |
Heirs of salvation |
|
|
|
89 |
|
Telestial surpasses all understanding |
|
|
99-100 |
Those who are some of one and some of another |
|
|
|
102 |
|
Not be gathered with the saints, church of the Firstborn |
|
|
103 |
Are liars, adulterers, whoremongers, loves and makes lies |
|
|
|
104 |
|
Suffered wrath of God on earth |
|
|
105 |
|
Suffer the vengeance of eternal fire |
|
|
106 |
|
Suffer the wrath of God until fullness of times |
|
|
109 |
|
Were as innumerable as the stars |
|
|
112 |
|
Be servants of God |
|
|
112 |
|
Cannot go where God and Christ dwell |
Did you grow up in a home where any opposition to one parent was considered as "demonizing"??
Just wondering why this small group only seems concerned with pointing out the faults of Mormons.
It's more faultlines -- than faults. By measuring faultlines, experts can gauge likely future disaster zones and ensure proper codifications to protect against home and business collapses, thereby saving lives. You know, faultline finding is a pretty detailed and even "negative" business. You're just trying to diagnose locations; measure movement over a given year by mere inches. All for what? Protect vs. impending disaster.
A spiritual disaster is coming to many. Jesus said "wide is the road" leading to destruction & "narrow the way" to life. That wasn't exactly a rah-rah pep talk.
Other points: (1) By using the word "only," you seem to assume that you know what we do with our lives 24/7. (Hey, we can multi-task) Many of us also post in threads beyond Mormonism.
(2) What's really absurd is that your out-of-balanced concerned with how a "small group" spends its "electric time" each week; yet have you ever contacted a Mormon and asked them why they send out 52,000 Missionaries who spend two years of their lives, 6-days-a-week, 70 hours a week, who are seemingly "only...concerned" with the spiritual welfare of others?
What? Do you think Lds missionaries go around with a "positive message?"
Marion G. Romney, Mitt's dad's cousin, used to oversee the Lds missionary enterprise in the early 1960s. He taught Lds missionaries that one of the top four "talking points" was for them to mention the "universal apostasy" & restoration.
What's the "universal apostasy?" Lds believe ALL Christians are "apostates"-- that the Christian church universally abandoned the faith. (No different than Muslims who call us "infidels").
So, Raider, how 'bout you wondering why this "large group" (of 52,000 Lds missionaries; literally over a million sent out since 1830)...
...goes to communities--some times that is 75% Christian
--and these missionaries never seems to tire of them calling Christians...
...apostates...?
..."corrupt"...?(printed in Lds Pearl of Great Price as description of Christian professing believers)
...and creedally abominable?...a word meaning "putrid" (same source)
this small group only seems concerned with pointing out the faults of Mormons.
- - - -
I as posted before on this thread, most of us were either LDS at one point and saw the light and/or have family and friends who are LDS.
BTW, we are not a ‘small group’.