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To: RnMomof7

You do have a queen. Revelation 12 describes a woman, “clothed with the sun...and on her head a crown of twelve stars,” with a Child Who “who was to rule all nations with an iron rod: and her son was taken up to God, and to his throne.” The Child is obviously Christ the King, so how is not the crowned woman (Mary) a queen?


299 posted on 02/17/2010 12:48:40 PM PST by Pyro7480 ("If you know how not to pray, take Joseph as your master, and you will not go astray." - St. Teresa)
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To: Pyro7480

Nice YOPIOS. Reading the full chapter, the woman is Israel, for the Christian church has never fled into the wilderness, nor has the devil waged war with a remnant of her seed.


302 posted on 02/17/2010 12:55:52 PM PST by 1000 silverlings (everything that deceives, also enchants: Plato)
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To: Pyro7480
God carried Israel into the desert, the 12 tribes are Israel

Exodus 19

Then Moses went up to God, and the Lord called to him from the mountain and said, “This is what you are to say to the house of Jacob and what you are to tell the people of Israel: 4‘You yourselves have seen what I did to Egypt, and how I carried you on eagles’ wings and brought you to myself.

The Church is the bride. A man does not marry his mother

Isaiah 61:10

I will greatly rejoice in the LORD, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decketh himself with ornaments, and as a bride adorneth herself with her jewels.

307 posted on 02/17/2010 1:06:06 PM PST by 1000 silverlings (everything that deceives, also enchants: Plato)
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To: Pyro7480
You do have a queen. Revelation 12 describes a woman, “clothed with the sun...and on her head a crown of twelve stars,” with a Child Who “who was to rule all nations with an iron rod: and her son was taken up to God, and to his throne.” The Child is obviously Christ the King, so how is not the crowned woman (Mary) a queen?

This scripture is metaphor . The woman is Israel birthing Christ

1 And a great sign appeared in heaven: A woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars: John called this a SIGN not a replay of a previous event

2 And being with child, she cried travailing in birth, and was in pain to be delivered.

Birth pains are a result of the curse of original sin.. If Mary was born without original sin, she would not have "travailed" in pain..the pain was the pain of Israel under Roman authority at the time of Christ's birth
Scripturally Joseph’s dream (Genesis 37:9-11) indicates that this is Israel

3 And there was seen another sign in heaven: and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads, and ten horns: and on his head seven diadems:

Was there a red dragon there ready to eat the child?

4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman who was ready to be delivered; that, when she should be delivered, he might devour her son.

5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with an iron rod: and her son was taken up to God, and to his throne.

6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she had a place prepared by God, that there they should feed her a thousand two hundred sixty days.

Mary never fled into the desert for 1260 days

7 And there was a great battle in heaven, Michael and his angels fought with the dragon, and the dragon fought and his angels:

8 And they prevailed not, neither was their place found any more in heaven.

9 And that great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, who seduceth the whole world; and he was cast unto the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying: Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: because the accuser of our brethren is cast forth, who accused them before our God day and night.

11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of the testimony, and they loved not their lives unto death.

12 Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you that dwell therein. Woe to the earth, and to the sea, because the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, knowing that he hath but a short time.

13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman, who brought forth the man child:

14 And there were given to the woman two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the desert unto her place, where she is nourished for a time and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

Mary never grew wings and flew away ... or at least I never saw a picture or painting of that ??? 
Eagle’s Wings are an emblem from the Exodus deliverance (Exodus 19:4), again seeming to be a symbol of Israel

15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth after the woman, water as it were a river; that he might cause her to be carried away by the river.

16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the river, which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

17 And the dragon was angry against the woman: and went to make war with the rest of her seed, who keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Again seeming to be a connection between Israel and the church today... which are the seed of Abraham
The Catholic church does not get to take the 1st part of the revelation and then skip the middle and move to the end to apply it . EITHER IT IS ALL ABOUT MARY or as John says ..it is a sign As I have said.. The queen of heaven is a Pagan title..not one applied to that lowly handmaiden of the lord

338 posted on 02/17/2010 1:28:38 PM PST by RnMomof7 (Here I stand. I can do no other. God help me. Amen.)
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