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Can't the Holy Father Just Make the Liturgical Reform Happen?
The New Theological Movement ^ | 1/30/10

Posted on 02/01/2010 12:00:26 PM PST by marshmallow

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To: backslacker
What is your point? As the stewards of the Bible, of course the Church assigned the numbering; the biblical text itself provides more than 10 imperative commands, indicates that there are 10 of them, yet fails to assign any numbering for the commands. This is much like the verse numbering that the Church assigned to the scriptures, despite the biblical texts themselves having no verse numbering.

Division of the commandments as listed in Exodus 20

The passage in Exodus 20 contains more than ten imperative statements, totalling 14 or 15 in all. While the Bible itself assigns the count of "10", using the Hebrew phrase aseret had'varim ('the 10 words', 'statements' or 'things'), this phrase does not appear in Exodus 20.[10] Various religions parse the commandments differently. The table below highlights those differences.

Division of the Ten Commandments by religion/denomination
Commandment Jewish (Talmudic)**** Anglican, Reformed, and other Christian Orthodox Catholic, Lutheran**
I am the Lord your God 1 preface 1 1
You shall have no other gods before me 2 1
You shall not make for yourself an idol 2 2
You shall not make wrongful use of the name of your God 3 3 3 2
Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy 4 4 4 3
Honor your father and mother 5 5 5 4
You shall not murder* 6 6 6 5
You shall not commit adultery 7 7 7 6
You shall not steal*** 8 8 8 7
You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor 9 9 9 8
You shall not covet your neighbor's wife 10 10 10 9
You shall not covet anything that belongs to your neighbor 10
*

21 posted on 02/03/2010 8:40:02 AM PST by Notwithstanding (Wer glaubt ist nie allein. Who believes is never alone.)
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To: backslacker

You are all over the map.

Your link highlights the importance of the Didache, and (mistakenly) tries to use the Didache to bolster the addition of the doxology to the end of the Our Father.

Curiously, your favored reference elevates the Didache, which is a wonderful work that underrcores most all of the Catholic doctrines and practices that you reject as non-scriptural - especially the liturgical nature of worship and the Catholic beliefs about the Eucharist.


22 posted on 02/03/2010 8:52:46 AM PST by Notwithstanding (Wer glaubt ist nie allein. Who believes is never alone.)
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To: backslacker

“For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever and ever. Amen”

The doxology of the prayer is not contained in Luke’s version, nor is it present in the earliest manuscripts of Matthew, representative of the Alexandrian text, but is present in the manuscripts representative of the Byzantine text.

The first known use of the doxology, in a less lengthy form (”for yours is the power and the glory forever”), as a conclusion for the Lord’s Prayer (in a version slightly different from that of Matthew) is in the Didache, 8:2.

There are at least ten different versions of the doxology in early manuscripts of Matthew before it seems to have standardised.

Jewish prayers at the time had doxological endings.

The doxology may have been originally appended to the Lord’s Prayer for use during congregational worship.

If so, it could be based on 1 Chronicles 29:11.

Most scholars do not consider it part of the original text of Matthew, and modern translations do not include it, mentioning it only in footnotes.

Latin Rite Roman Catholics, as well as some Lutherans, do not use it when reciting the Lord’s Prayer, but it has been included as an independent item, not as part of the Lord’s Prayer, in the 1970 revision of the Mass.

It is attached to the version of the Lord’s Prayer used by Eastern Christianity (including Byzantine Rite Eastern Catholic Churches) and by most Protestants.

A minority, generally fundamentalists, posit that the doxology was so important that early manuscripts of Matthew neglected it due to its obviousness, though several other quite obvious things are mentioned in the Gospels.


23 posted on 02/03/2010 9:09:54 AM PST by Notwithstanding (Wer glaubt ist nie allein. Who believes is never alone.)
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