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To: webstersII
I'm only taking issue with your mindset that God's covenant with the nation of Israel somehow affects you as a Christian.

All the promises/blessings come via Abraham. There was only ONE promised Seed (Jesus) of Abraham, and through Him all the nations would be blessed. The nation of Israel was only the vessel.

Gal 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

The law given later at Sinai do NOT affect the promises made to Abraham.

Gal 3:17And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
3:18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

Thus, our justification comes solely by faith in Christ Jesus.

Gal 3:29And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

I disagree that Israel ever prospered in a secular way. Solomon called his own accomplishments vanity. (Eccl 2:10-11)

169 posted on 12/21/2009 10:14:53 PM PST by Dallas
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To: Dallas

“I’m only taking issue with your mindset that God’s covenant with the nation of Israel somehow affects you as a Christian.”

The covenant with Israel doesn’t specifically affect us. It was a type and shadow of what was to come. Each Christian has a covenant, a better one, now instead of the covenant for the nation.

“through Him all the nations would be blessed. The nation of Israel was only the vessel.”

Yes, Israel was the covenant nation where the savior was born. But it is much more than that. God wanted Israel to bring the rest of the nations to jealousy, i.e., they would become jealous because of Isral’s prosperity as a nation and Israel could teach the other nations that the prosperity was a side benefit of obedience to God (see Deut. 28, Deut. 8).

“The law given later at Sinai do NOT affect the promises made to Abraham. “

I don’t know what your point is here.

“Thus, our justification comes solely by faith in Christ Jesus.”

Yep.

“I disagree that Israel ever prospered in a secular way. Solomon called his own accomplishments vanity. (Eccl 2:10-11)”

Go back and read the part where God says that he would give Solomon great rewards of wealth because he asked first for wisdom. How much more specific can you get than that? Solomon decided that all the wealth was vanity after living in disobedience but that doesn’t change the fact that God blessed him with it.

I can’t imagine how you could possibly say Israel never prospered in a secular way. Are you saying they were poor? The only time they were ever poor in the OT was when they had disobeyed and they became a debtor nation, and then they got conquered and taken into slavery.

There are tons of examples of people prospering in a secular way in the OT (and NT). There are many instances where it specifically says that God blessed them and prospered them. It’s part of the promises of the covenant that God made with them. He said that they could choose blessing or curse, life or death, and then He went on to explain the physical (secular) blessings available in very specific terms. I could point all this out to you but you seem to have a good knowledge of the scriptures, so I imagine you are familiar with many of these.

As a father, I like to give good gifts to my children — as long as they are not living in rebellion. As a heavenly father, God gave the gift of His Son, but also said He delights in giving good gifts to His children.

Why are so many Christians afraid to believe that God wants them to prosper in EVERY area of their life? There are so many verses in the Bible which state this as a desire of God. It seems so obvious that it is one of the characteristics of our heavenly father.

And there is no such thing as ONLY being prosperous financially. People who only prosper financially without having their soul prosper in the same measure wind up hurting themselves and others.


192 posted on 12/24/2009 6:21:53 AM PST by webstersII
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