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To: RobbyS

>I have no reason to think you are.

I was not inferring i was a prophet, though i think Luther, despite his faults, was a type of one, and who actually helped Rome to partially reform itself.

But the question is, by what criteria do you ascertain that one is a messenger of God?

The Bereans examined the preaching of the very apostles by the Scriptures, (Acts 17:11) and found them true, and it was by the Scriptures that Jesus justified His claim and doctrines and answered questions, (Mt. 22, etc.) and that Apollos (Acts 18:28) and the apostles showed that Jesus was the Christ, and verified the message of the gospel, and convicted men of sin, and of righteousness and of judgment, (Acts 2:14ff; 7; 13:16ff), and upon which new revelation and doctrines were established, (Romans, Hebrews) and discipline, (Acts 15) and Scripture-based customs upheld. (1Cor. 11)

This, and overt supernatural Divine attestation,(Acts 4:33; 5:12; Rm. 15:19 and their sacrificial love and holiness, (2Cor. 6:1-10) were their credentials as servants of Christ, and as apostles who had personally seen the resurrected Christ and were taught by Him. (1Cor. 9:1; Gal. 1)

While God certainly founded both a nation and a church - both upon faith - and entrusted the laws, covenants, and promises of God to it, it is not by formal organic historical lineage that constitutes either a true child of Abraham or a Christian, (Rm. 2:28,29) by faith which is demonstrably substantiated by that tangible class of revelation which is affirmed to be wholly inspired of God, and formally and materially sufficient.

In contrast is an authority whose validity is really based upon its own declaration that it is conditionally infallible, and by such its declaration of infallibility is rendered infallible, and thus its interpretation of Scripture upon which it attempts to affirm its infallibly defined infallibility, with its other basis being a supposedly unbroken lineage of Popes, which includes men who would be disqualified from even church fellowship. (1Cor. 5:11)


105 posted on 01/04/2010 1:57:51 PM PST by daniel1212 (and there is no new thing under the sun. Eccl. 4:9)
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To: daniel1212

Popes do not claim to be prophets and seers, but guardians of True Doctrine. But as for the rest, our acceptance of the Scriptures depend on our acceptance of the testimony of men who succeeded the Apostles, or if you like, came after them in time. As for Luther’s reforms. you suppose that there was no other reform movement in the Church contemporary to his, which is not the case. Indeed, Cardinal Pole, the leader of the Church of England under Mary Tudor, was one of many reformers in the Catholic Church, almost contemporary with Luther, as was Thomas More. The so-called Counterreformation was in fact the triumph of a Catholic Reform movement, the popes after 1580 has been among its leaders, and the Council of Trent an expression of its reforms.


106 posted on 01/04/2010 4:26:30 PM PST by RobbyS (Pray with the suffering souls.)
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