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To: Alan2; Safrguns
Safrguns, I read your reply to this and thought I'd add a thought or too.

Two reasonable people equally informed, seldom disagree. If you want to help your son you must become equally informed about the LDS church. Have you read the Book of Mormon? Have you prayed and asked God if it is true?

I have studied about the bom and come to the same discernment you have Safr - it is a piece of poor fiction. I would say that I am very informed. Notice nothing in Alan's statement to critically evaluate this bom in the way that the Bereans did.

The Bible say If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God.

Which is not the same as reading and praying. But contextrally James was speaking about persecution, not reading the bom. Of course, the use of "wisdom" in that passage also goes beyond blind faith.

The Bible says that there will be both true and false prophets in the last days. By their fruits you shall know them. The true church of Jesus Christ will be led by prophets that receive revelations from Him.

True, it does talk about false prophets and teachers. It also tells us that part of that 'fruit' are false teachings and sources (Gal 1:8-9). Smith's fruits are polygamy (still denigrating women today, both in Lds and flds), racism (still no apologies from the prophets for denying godhood to blacks), massacre at Mountain Meadows, just to name a few

We have 3 choices today. We can follow true prophets like Joseph Smith and the prophets that followed after him. They will lead us to Jesus. Or we can follow false prophets that will lead us away from Jesus. Or we can follow no prophets which will result in our not being led to Jesus.

Not the underlying presupposition - smith was a true prophet. The fundamental question is completely ignored - WAS smith a 'true' prophet of God and how to judge that. That modifies the equation significantly from where Alan is trying to funnel the attention to. If the bom is 'true' and contains as it claims, the history of early americas, there should be proofs - archaeology. If it is true, it should relate to the flora and fauna correctly - which it doesn't. Many studies have shown that the bom relies upon plagiarism from multiple sources - the bible, a "View to the Hebrews", Spaulding's writings, among others.

If Smith was a prophet, his prophecies would have come to pass - they haven't.

Finally, he teaches another gospel not taught by the apostles. Safr is correct in his analysis of the bom and the mormon encouraged (circular argument on their part for starters).

37 posted on 09/20/2009 6:20:58 PM PDT by Godzilla (3-7-77)
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To: Godzilla

Thank you...

I’ve been wondering in more recent months just what percentage of ex-mormons left the faith because of a logical argument or the exposure of a falsehood in their scriptures.

After going through what I have with my own son of 17, I am thoroughly convinced that it is truly a spirit of deception that must be broken before any “reason” can begin to have any hope of persuasion.

It would be so helpful to me to hear from those who have left LDS as to what it was that turned them.


41 posted on 09/20/2009 6:53:45 PM PDT by Safrguns
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