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To: annalex

In 841, one needs only acknowledge God the Creator, not Jesus the Savior (in fact, as Muslims do, you can reject Jesus as Savior), to enter Heaven.

In 846, one can acknowledge God the Creator AND Jesus the Savior, yet reject the supremacy of the Catholic Church, and be denied entry to Heaven.

These two are inconsistent with the Bible (Jesus is the way to Salvation, you must come to the Father through Him).

And in each statement, the Catholic Church has become the way to God; that is in direct opposition the quoted scripture you provide.

But you’re dodging my questions: can a heretic be saved? Will heretics be in Heaven? Yes, No, or We Don’t Know?


559 posted on 09/01/2009 11:45:03 AM PDT by PugetSoundSoldier (Indignation over the Sting of Truth is the Defense of the Indefensible)
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To: PugetSoundSoldier
Individual heretics, or even non-Christians, can be saved through the extraordinary grace of Jesus Christ. Those who are saved, are Catholic converts even though their conversion only happened at the moment of their death and did not take any particular ritualistic form. We don't know who individually is and is not saved among the Catholic Christians either. But we know what helps one to reach salvation, and what hurts. Heresy hurts, the Church helps.

Canon 841 merely says that the Muslims are "included" in "the plan of salvation". But not far from is, Canon 836 says that "All men are called to this catholic unity of the People of God. . . . And to it, in different ways, belong or are ordered: the Catholic faithful, others who believe in Christ, and finally all mankind, called by God's grace to salvation." Canon 841 also acknowledges that the Muslim, compared to the pagans or the Atheists, adore God the Father, so that is, relatively to the others, helpful to them. The thrust of the paragraph is that everyone is called to salvation, because the Church was told to "baptize all nations".

Canon 846 explains that whenever one is saved -- and we don't know who is and who isn't -- he is saved as a member of the Body of Christ which is the Catholic Church. If a Mulsim refuses to his last breath to enter it, he cannot be saved, and if a Protestant refuses to his last breath to enter it, he cannot be saved, and if a Catholic refuses to remain in it, he cannot be saved either.

This is the relevant chapter "I BELIEVE IN THE HOLY CATHOLIC CHURCH"

Your mistake is to read 841 as if the acknowledgement of the Creator is sufficient to enter Heaven. Canon 841 does not say that. The root of your mistake is probably the belief common to many Protestants, that a particular set of beliefs is both necessary and sufficient for salvation. The fact is, we are not saved by faith alone, -- faith of any kind.

560 posted on 09/01/2009 1:47:49 PM PDT by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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