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Posted on 07/25/2009 2:40:04 AM PDT by Quix
The Bible says we cannot know the time of the Lord's return (Matthew 25:13). But the Scriptures make it equally clear that we can know the season of the Lord's return (1 Thessalonians 5:2-6):
"You yourselves know full well that the day of the Lord will come just like a thief in the night... But you brethren, are not in darkness, that the day should overtake you like a thief; for you are all sons of light and sons of day. We are not of night or darkness; so then let us not sleep as others do, but let us be alert and sober."
This passage asserts that Jesus is coming like "a thief in the night." But then it proceeds to make it clear that this will be true only for the pagan world and not for believers. His return should be no surprise to those who know Him and His Word, for they have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit to give them understanding of the nature of the times.
Furthermore, the Scriptures give us signs to watch for signs that will signal that Jesus is ready to return. The writer of the Hebrew letter referred to these signs when he proclaimed that believers should encourage one another when they see the day of judgment drawing near (Hebrews 10:25-27). Jesus also referred to the end time signs in His Olivet Discourse, given during the last week of His life (Matthew 24 and Luke 21). Speaking of a whole series of signs which He had given to His disciples, He said, "When you see all these things, recognize that He [the Son of Man that is, Jesus] is near, right at the door" (Matthew 24:33).
A Personal Experience
Every time I think of "Signs of the Times," I am reminded of a great man of God named Elbert Peak. I had the privilege of participating with him in a Bible prophecy conference held in Orlando, Florida in the early 1990's. Mr. Peak was about 80 years old at the time.
He had been assigned the topic, "The Signs of the Times." He began his presentation by observing, "Sixty years ago when I first started preaching, you had to scratch around like a chicken to find one sign of the Lord's soon return."
He paused for a moment, and then added, "But today there are so many signs I'm no longer looking for them. Instead, I'm listening for a sound the sound of a trumpet!"
The First Sign
One hundred years ago in 1907 there was not one single, tangible, measurable sign that indicated we were living in the season of the Lord's return. The first to appear was the Balfour Declaration which was issued by the British government on November 2, 1917.
This Declaration was prompted by the fact that during World War I the Turks sided with the Germans. Thus, when Germany lost the war, so did the Turks, and the victorious Allies decided to divide up both the German and Turkish empires.
The Turkish territories, called the Ottoman Empire, contained the ancient homeland of the Jewish people an area the Romans had named Palestine after the last Jewish revolt in 132-135 AD.
In 1917 Palestine included all of modern day Israel and Jordan. In the scheme the Allies concocted for dividing up the German and Turkish territories, Britain was allotted Palestine, and this is what prompted the Balfour Declaration. In that document, Lord Balfour, the British Foreign Secretary, declared that it was the intention of the British government to establish in Palestine "a national home for the Jewish people."
The leading Evangelical in England at the time was F. B. Meyer. He immediately recognized the prophetic significance of the Declaration, for he was well aware that the Scriptures prophesy that the Jewish people will be regathered to their homeland in unbelief right before the return of the Messiah (Isaiah 11:11-12).
Meyer sent out a letter to the Evangelical leaders of England asking them to gather in London in December to discuss the prophetic implications of the Balfour Declaration. In that letter, he stated, "The signs of the times point toward the close of the time of the Gentiles... and the return of Jesus can be expected any moment."
Before Meyer's meeting could be convened, another momentous event occurred. On December 11, 1917 General Edmund Allenby liberated the city of Jerusalem from 400 years of Turkish rule.
There is no doubt that these events in 1917 marked the beginning of the end times because they led to the worldwide regathering of the Jewish people to their homeland and the reestablishment of their state.
Since 1917
Since the time of the Balfour Declaration, we have witnessed throughout the 20th Century the appearance of sign after sign pointing to the Lord's soon return. There are so many of these signs today, in fact, that one would have to be either biblically illiterate or spiritually blind not to realize that we are living on borrowed time.
I have personally been searching the Bible for years in an effort to identify all the signs, and it has not been an easy task to get a hold on them. That's because there are so many of them, both in the Old and New Testaments.
I have found that the best way to deal with them is to put them in categories, and in doing that, I have come up with six categories of end time signs. We will explore these catetories beginning in Part 2 of this series.
INDEED.
I guess God didn’t get the memo from the
REPLACEMENTARIANS
telling Him that He COULD NOT do things that way on threat of . . .
wellll . . .
threat of . . .
pouty faced wailing and whining and interminable dust in the air???
Or maybe God is pretending that REPLACEMENTARIANS and all their pontificanting haughtiness are a figment of Calvin’s imagination.
As I summarized (and referenced) before, the reference would be to the awakened Israel during the time of the tribulation - not applicable to the current period.
The context of the discourse addresses the questions from the disciples
1. "When will these things be?" (The complete destruction of the temple)
2. "What will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?" (Inferring the end of the present age and beginning of the messianic age)
This is the context that Jesus' prophecies and parables are set within. In regards to #1, the AD 70 destruction did not fulfill the prophecy of 'not one stone will be left upon another' as there are quite a few stones left on top of each other.
In regards to #2, Jesus used the term "end of the age" before (MT 13:39, 40, 49; 28:20). In those prior usages, Jesus meant the end of the present age that will consummate in His second coming and a judgment of living unbelievers (cf. Jer. 29:22; 51:33; Dan. 3:6; Hos. 6:11; Joel 3:13; Zeph. 1:3). This will occur just before the messianic kingdom begins. The disciples used the phrase "the end of the age" as Jesus and the Old Testament prophets spoke of it. The disciples association of the two questions is considered by some to indicate that the two events were to be related within the same time frame.
Since Jesus is addressing Israel, and not the church, the parables can be reevaluated to indicate that the virgins/servants, etc are not Christians (for nothing can separate us from God) but another group - Israel.
Logically, that does not make any sense. If the synoptics were written before AD70 (as most conservatives/evangelicals agree), what is the issue with Matthew 24:4-34 being a predictive reference to AD70? Even if there were written after AD70, the words of Jesus recorded there are still from the AD33 timeframe, approx. 40 years (this generation) from the prophecy to the events.
Dispensationalists are hard-pressed to deny some relationship between Matthew 24:4-34 and AD70. So what the clever ones have done is to invent a so-called dual fulfillment, where Matthew 24:4-34 speaks of both AD70 and the Second Coming.
My position is that Matthew 24:4-34 is speaking of AD70 while vv 36 and following is a reference to the Second Coming. The change in subject and emphasis makes it pretty clear. In vv 4-34 Jesus gives very specific predictors of the event (wars and rumors of wars, famine, persecution of believers, etc). All these things preceded AD70. In vv36ff, there are no specific events as predictive. Instead we read language like But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only. For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. Therefore you also be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect. Very non-specific.
Many who advocate a post AD 70 authorship date do so because they discount prophecy a priori. Since there cannot be a supernatural knowledge of the future, any "prophecy" written must be fulfilled by that event - no matter if the facts of the event are something completely different than described by the prophecy. Thus their paradox - they must also deny OT prophecy in a similar manner and by doing so, must rationalize away the clear prophecies regarding Jesus.
I appreciate your concern, but that is not the case here.
However, the passage cannot find fulfillment in AD 70's destruction of Israel.
That is only a truism for those who accept the dispensationalism system as the basic method for interpreting the Bible. You views on Israel are obviously tainting the way you are interpreting that passage, and others.
For atonement of sin? That is what Ezekiel 40-48 literally says.
However, the passage cannot find fulfillment in AD 70’s destruction of Israel.
That is only a truism for those who accept the dispensationalism system as the basic method for interpreting the Bible. You views on Israel are obviously tainting the way you are interpreting that passage, and others.
= = = =
WHAT UTTER NONSENSE.
Understanding that NO [much less most] END TIMES UNRUBBERIZED BIBLICAL PROPHECIES were fulfilled in 70 A.D.
is true of virtually anyone, nearly everyone
with a microgram of fair-mindedness;
some functioning synapses above the level of an inebriated slug;
AN UNRUBBERIZED BIBLE;
an
UNRUBBERIZED history book;
and maybe the
courage to face truth vs one’s off the wall egotistical fantasies.
False, not in the Church Age.
Rut-ro! I smell a heresy.
Do you agree with this statement, that in this age of grace, "The point of testing is no longer legal obedience as the condition of salvation, but acceptance or rejection of Christ"?
Yet under the Mosaic administration people were saved by obedience to the law?
One knows from whence one speaks.
. . . .
and the compulsive, reflexive swat/jerk/rush is on to
try vainly to cram
ALMIGHTY GOD
back into the miniscule REPLACEMENTARIAN’S tiny little box.
I don’t think God got that memo.
Yeah, My PhD in Clinical Psychology did have a lot to do with studying UTTER NONSENSE and those who dispensed it.
My PhD in Clinical Psychology
I wondered which one you’d use.
That’s one of my favorites.
Thanks.
Thankfully, at least 2 FREEPERS know the truth! LOL.
It’s comforting that yet again
REPLACEMENTARIANS
are on the OPPOSITE side from the truth.
My PhD in Clinical Psychology
Point being, anybody can claim to be anything at all on the InterWebz. Mall Ninja, Grand Wizard, Buzz Lightyear or Simon the LART Wielder. No reason to believe anyone. Even a "clinical soothsayer" or rattler of bones. Who cares?
Or possibly, as I suspect, a process gone wonky and in need of rebooting.
'ssh root@quix.someobscurecorner.cx "/etc/init.d/quixie restart"'
Im a full fledged Dispy!
Nuff said.
Interesting. Did Jesus anywhere warn or predict the destruction of the temple that happened in AD70?
Sounds like a PhD thesis for clinical psychology.
Were that the only instance of 'dual fulfillment', you would have a good arguement. However, the concept is also well based within the OT in regards to Jesus. That to me is not hard pressed, but consistent application of scriptural understanding.
My position is that Matthew 24:4-34 is speaking of AD70 while vv 36 and following is a reference to the Second Coming. . . . . All these things preceded AD70.
All well and good, so the gospel was preached into all the world before AD 70? (MT 24:14) How was MT 24:30-31 specifically fulfilled? (30. And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. )
There are other specific points I could make demanding fulfillment in AD70, but I would propose that you would be hard pressed to show that this prophecy was fully and completely expressed by the AD 70 destruction of Jerusalem should we review your designated sections verse by verse against history. It is a much stronger arguement to infer that Jesus and his disciples were refering to the end of the tribulation period/start of the messianic reign of Christ which clearly the two versed I cited above refer to.
For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. Therefore you also be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect. Very non-specific.
LOL, Jesus' citation of Noah and the ark are also a common type of the rapture. Secondly, it was directed at non-believers, not believers. You may not be looking for the rapture, but that won't stop you from being raptured :)
That is only a truism for those who accept the dispensationalism system as the basic method for interpreting the Bible. You views on Israel are obviously tainting the way you are interpreting that passage, and others.
Not really, my adherance to the dispensational view is founded in part upon the historical fulfillment of prophecy and God's dealings with Israel as documented in the Bible. Secondly, I've pointed out the contextural focus of Jesus' discourse and my understanding and interpretation fits within that context. If you insist that Mt 24:4-34 deal specifically with the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70, you will have to do a lot of hard documentation to prove your points verse by verse.
Sounds like purgatory.
This does not mean the spiritual sacrifice more precious than the blood of bulls and goats isnt still recognized in heaven, but a sacrificial system does appear in the Millennium.
Would you say then that there is nothing in Scripture that prevents a person from bringing a blood offering of bulls or goats today as cleansing for the relationship between God and men? And that such an action would be pleasing to God?
Israel would be awakened after the rapture and during the tribulation - that is the setting. There are many instances in the bible of those who 'claim' to be a follower but do not have the heart change so to speak to back it up spiritually. Thus I think Jesus' is saying in reference to these parables is that just because you may be a Jew, you still have to have that encounter with Him, you can't get in on coat tails. High falluten theology LOL, but Jesus is warning for people to be real in their acceptance of Him as their Savior and Lord.
When talking end times, it is extremely difficult not to bring our own viewpoints on eschatology into the Scriptures. So if I am a pre-tribber, then I view everything through the pre-trib lens, same for post-trib, etc. Obviously we differ, but I do enjoy the discussion since it makes me go back to the Scriptures and meditate on them more.
Well, I'm glad you are enjoying this. My view comes about as a progressive elimination of the options and their validity to the whole of the bible. I some times refer to my self as a "pantrib", it'll all pan out in the end. I just think there is a better consistency within the bible for pretrib rapture - it answers the questions and scriptures better.
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