***That must be why he made it a requirement for Elders and Deacons in 1 Timothy 3 and Titus 1.
Hey now, you can’t rely on the Bible to make your point! There’s a catechism to consider! ;)***
Funny. I’ve been posting Scripture that the Reformed are pointedly ignoring. Where are the Bible Believers (tm)? Could it be that they are Scripturally unsound?
Which scriptures are those? I don’t recall seeing them.
“Where are the Bible Believers (tm)? Could it be that they are Scripturally unsound?”
I’m a Bible believer and I’m right here.
What does that have to do with being or not being scripturally sound or unsound? Perhaps they are spending time with family?
What scripture have you posted that nobody responded to? Do you feel ignored?
The only post of yours I’ve can find on this thread posting scripture is 410, with Matt 16:13-19.
“13 Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, “Who do people say that the Son of Man is?” 14 And they said, “Some say John the Baptist, others say Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”
15 He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” 16 Simon Peter replied, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” 17 And Jesus answered him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah! For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven.
18 And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. 19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”
So lets look at that passage, and particularly verse 19.
But before we do, lets also add Matthew 18:
“15 “If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. 17 If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. 18 Truly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. 19 Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in heaven. 20 For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I among them.”
Also John 20:
“Then the disciples were glad when they saw the Lord. 21 Jesus said to them again, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I am sending you.” 22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you withhold forgiveness from any, it is withheld.”
This throws some light on Matthew 16.
Verse 16:18, as best as this unlearned Baptist figures it:
For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven. 18 And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Common Baptist interpretation is that Jesus used a play on words. Peter means rock, and he had just made a leap of faith that Jesus is “the Christ, the Son of the living God.” And it is this faith that Jesus will build his Church upon. Furthermore, “the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.” I’ve read that Jews of that day would understand ‘the gates of hell’ to refer to death, and death would not prevail against faith such as Peter demonstrated.
I realize this is NOT the interpretation the Catholic Church uses. However, I think it harmonizes better with all the rest of scripture, which does NOT indicate Peter was supreme over all the other Apostles.
However, I cheerfully grant that Peter was an extraordinary fellow, whose role in the foundation of the church cannot be denied or minimized. But supreme over all the Apostles, and with his successors as Bishop Supreme forever? That seems quite a stretch!
Another interpretation is that this verse was fulfilled when Peter preached at Pentecost, and then led the way for Gentiles to follow God.
Now, verse 19:
“I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”
To this, he adds the other disciples & believers in Chapter 18:
“18 Truly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. 19 Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in heaven. 20 For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I among them.”
I conclude all believers are added, since it says “where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I among them.”
This is the ministry of the church. Some say it refers to church discipline, since that is the topic that immediately precedes it. The 2-3 refer to the ones who went with you in verse 16. That makes sense to me, since Paul wrote, “11 But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindlernot even to eat with such a one. 12 For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? 13 God judges those outside. “Purge the evil person from among you.” - 1 Cor 5.
Certainly, it is hard to believe it applies ONLY to Peter, since a much broader group was given the same power in Matthew 18 & John 20.
Hope this helps. I’ve had a bloody nose much of the day (clumsiness, not violence) and really hadn’t paid any attention to these verses until a few days ago.