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To: HangnJudge
From A Tiptoe through TULIP:

Total depravity

Despite its name, the doctrine of total depravity does not mean men are always and only sinful. Calvinists do not think we are as sinful as we possibly could be. They claim our free will has been injured by original sin to the point that, unless God gives us special grace, we cannot free ourselves from sin and choose to serve God in love. We might choose to serve him out of fear, but not out of unselfish love [9].

What would a Catholic think of this teaching? While he would not use the term "total depravity" to describe the doctrine [10], he would actually agree with it. The accepted Catholic teaching is that, because of the fall of Adam, man cannot do anything out of supernatural love unless God gives him special grace to do so [11].

Thomas Aquinas declared that special grace is necessary for man to do any supernaturally good act, to love God, to fulfill God's commandments, to gain eternal life, to prepare for salvation, to rise from sin, to avoid sin, and to persevere [12].

[...]

Notes:

9. There is nothing wrong with serving out of godly fear. The Bible often uses fear of divine chastisement as a motivator. Love and a certain kind of fear do not exclude each other; a child may both love his parents and have a healthy fear of his parents' discipline. But service based on fear only, being self-interested, does not please God in a supernatural way and does not receive a supernatural reward. Love is necessary to please God and receive rewards.

10. That term is badly misleading, as even Calvinists acknowledge. For example, Calvinist theologian R.C. Sproul proposes the alternative term "radical corruption," although this is not much better. Author Lorraine Boettner uses the much better term "total inability."

11. In Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma Ludwig Ott gives the following as a defined article of faith: "For every salutary act internal supernatural grace of God (gratia elevans) is absolutely necessary" (Ott, 229). He goes on to cite the second Council of Orange, which stated that "as often as we do good God operates in us and with us, so that we may operate" (canon 9) and that "man does no good except that which God brings about" (canon 20). The Council of Trent solemnly condemned the proposition that "without the predisposing inspiration of the Holy Ghost and without his help, man can believe, hope, love, or be repentant as he ought, so that the grace of justification my be bestowed upon him" (Decree on Justification, canon 3). The Church teaches God's grace is necessary to enable man to be lifted out of sin, display genuine supernatural virtues, and please God.

12. Summa Theologiae (hereafter ST) I-II:109:2-10.


12 posted on 03/22/2009 3:48:33 PM PDT by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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To: annalex
Thank you for the commentary

Though what life I've been appointed
I have worshiped in Methodist, Presbyterian, Lutheran, Pentecostal, Episcopalian, and most assuredly Catholic Churches

I was privileged to be a Godfather of a boy from a Catholic family - he is now “confirmed”, but my service was pitifully inept

What I have seen from this journey is that amongst Christian Faiths, there is not so much a difference in Truths as much as Vision. Each of the local Bodies of Christ see more clearly some aspects of our walk in Christ, and less well other aspects. The same was true of individuals. I've yet to meet just one man who wasn't severely flawed and damaged, nor have I seen a church that wasn't similarly flawed. Thus is our existence on this Earth

Perhaps there was one, but we killed Him about 2000 years ago

If I had a hope for those who see incompletely (all of us) it would be that We (and I) would learn to honor that Vision that has been appointed to others, without necessarily agreeing with it.

I trust only in the Lord, and what record we have of his days on this Earth, as well as the accounts of those who knew Him. Prophesy and new Vision are possible, but must be tested against that which is known to be true (Testing the Spirits), must not disagree by not one Jot or Tittle, and must further illuminate what is already known

But I see through Darkened Glasses Dimly...

C.S. Lewis had a useful vision in "Mere Christianity" as a building with hallways and rooms. One might live in the hallways all your life, and still be Christian, but the greater depth of life, understand, and Vision was in the rooms off the halls

Live in Peace
Live in Victory
Know that there is also Love in this World

17 posted on 03/22/2009 4:45:38 PM PDT by HangnJudge
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