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1 posted on 02/27/2009 2:26:17 AM PST by rhema
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To: Caleb1411; Salvation; logos

2 posted on 02/27/2009 2:27:32 AM PST by rhema ("Break the conventions; keep the commandments." -- G. K. Chesterton)
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To: rhema

Very nice.


3 posted on 02/27/2009 3:06:45 AM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: rhema
An "easy" way to read the Bible for the first time, again, is to read it in a new language! John's gospel, with its simple, poetic, repetitive language, is a good place to start. You get to Chapter 21, tell yourself, "Wow! I'm actually reading and understanding Language X" -- then you turn the page and hit the wall with Acts! I know a guy who's struggling through the Turkish NT, and blogging the adventure HERE.
4 posted on 02/27/2009 3:27:33 AM PST by RJR_fan (Winners and lovers shape the future. Whiners and losers TRY TO PREDICT IT.)
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To: rhema
Actually a good article.

When trying to read as if the passage applies to oneself, it must be remembered that although the entire Bible was written for our learning (1 Corinthians 10), it was not all written TO me.

Pay attention to the distinctions and divisions that the Holy Spirit deliberately set forth (1 Corinthians 10:32).

If I am reading the book of Leviticus, for example, I might appropriate a spiritual lesson from any verse in the book. But FIRST OF ALL, I must recognize that there are hundreds of literal instructions there that were not written TO me as a New Testament Christian to carry out and practice literally.

There are instructions there for the Nation of Israel that made them separate from the other nations of the world; to preserve that nation intact until such time as the Seed of the Woman, Christ, would come into the world THROUGH that nation.

More specifically, the dietary laws given to Israel (Leviticus ch. 11) for their health and preservation might also be a good idea today, nutritionally. There are many who attempt to abide by these limitations for health reasons. Fine.

I know of a pastor who built a children's home and tried to practice Old Testament dietary law in the home for the purpose of keeping the children healthier while they were under his stewardship. It worked quite well.

But the minute I try to apply the laws of Leviticus chapter 11 to my congregation legalistically, I encounter the Apostle Paul, a Jew himself, writing to a pastor of Gentiles, “ . . . a doctrine of devils . . . commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. For EVERY creature of God is good, and NOTHING to be refused, IF it be received with thanksgiving: For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.” (1 Timothy 4:1-5)

Israelites were under law to REFUSE pork, and shrimp, and rabbit, etc., LITERALLY. When I read Leviticus, I must be careful just how I make an application to myself.

We have yet to meet any ministers of the Gospel of Jesus Christ applying Matthew chapter 10, or Luke chapters 9 and 10 to themselves in any sense that accept the words just as they say.

Yes, avid reader of the Bible deduces a hermeneutic. Yes, church members seem to absorb their church's particularly hermeneutic, often without question, as the fish accepts the water.

But the Scriptures should not be interpreted according to what the words are PRESUMED to say, but by what they actually do say. And if this is followed, then it will put definite boundaries on applying any give passage to one’s self.

The question must be asked about any Biblical injunction, “Specifically to WHOM did the Holy Spirit write the passage, and what are the characteristics of those people that are different from our characteristics? What is it about the specific calling or commission of those people that is different from our calling and commission?

The differences don't have to be guessed at; the same Scriptures delineate the differences. These differences and divisions must be observed.

Since the Scriptures tell us to “rightly DIVIDE the word of truth” (2 Timothy 2:15), then we must expect that those RIGHT DIVISIONS are also laid out in the same Bible.

There are DIVISIONS in the Bible.

What does God require from the Gentile world? Or better, how is the Church of God supposed to deal with the Gentile world?

What does God require from the Nation of Israel, AS A NATION? And is God specifically dealing with ISRAEL AS A NATION TODAY? (Read Romans chapter 11)

What does God require from the Church of God as the Body of Christ?

Divisions. They exist.

We read the WHOLE Bible. It was written for our learning. Every verse has a specific doctrinal import, or a specific instruction to be carried out. Somebody had to, or has to, carry out the instruction. But is that someone ME? Each verse may have dozens of spiritual applications to our Christian walk.

The Scriptures cannot be broken, and whatever spiritual application I might see must not break the Scriptures; it must be consistent with the Scriptures. It must be consistent with the division of the Scriptures that God wrote TO ME as a New Testament member of the Body of Christ.

5 posted on 02/27/2009 3:27:50 AM PST by John Leland 1789
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To: rhema
Whenever possible, read a verse as applying to myself glorify Jesus.
6 posted on 02/27/2009 3:35:18 AM PST by Raycpa
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To: rhema

I went to an Assembly of God church for nearly 20 years, starting with a week after I became a Christian. I really tried to get into the tongues thing, but it never worked for me. And then one of the “messages of wisdom” spoken in front of the congregation turned out to be utterly false. Interestingly, it was the only quantifiable one ever uttered the entire time I was there.

I also really wanted to believe in the Pre-tribulation view that was dominant, but the more I studied, the more convinced I was that it was wishfull thinking at best. I became a very strong mid tribulationist or “Post-tribulation, pre-wrath”.

But I have attended several different churches since then and have a hard time plugging into any of them. I play bass for worship at each one that I end up attending, but I still feel “separate” from the rest of the congregation.

Honestly, I did at the AG church as well. I went on camping trips with other men, watched football sundays, etc. Yet I enjoyed none of those things. I was just trying to get along.

I had long talks with my former pastor, who is now my best friend about this whole “what is the function of the church” thing and he ended up writing a book about it called “And no religion too: thoughts on the spectator church”. Here’s a link to it: http://edwardgoblebooks.com/

I am still trying to work this whole “church in the US” thing out, but I just try to be a Christian around whoever I happen to be around. If they are a brother as well, that’s great! We have something in common beyond what we already discovered we have in common.

And no more camping/fishing trips.


10 posted on 02/27/2009 10:33:21 AM PST by RobRoy
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To: rhema
Without anyone ever having to lay out the rules of interpretation, we assimilate the views of the group we inhabit, with the precision of a child's mimicry of his parents' accent.

True...And very few churches I beleive tell the congregants to open the scripture and 'prove all things'...Prove IN THE SCRIPTURES whether I tell you truths...

Many churches will tell you, 'I'll do the thinkin', you do the doin''...That's where the blind are leading the blind...

• Do not assume, without good reason, that a blessing is meant only for the future, at Christ's return (e.g., "that you may know what is the hope to which He has called you, what are the riches of His glorious inheritance in the saints, and what is the immeasurable greatness of His power toward us who believe, according to the greatness of His great might that He worked in Christ when He raised Him from the dead" —Ephesians 1:18-20).

Don't forget the first verse in the run, the 'key' to understanding and believing the scriptures...

Eph 1:17 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:

Eph 1:18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,
Eph 1:19 And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power,
Eph 1:20 Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,

15 posted on 02/28/2009 5:07:10 AM PST by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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