[San Joaquin] Valley Presbyterian group may split [PCUSA]

The Fresno Bee ^ | September 22, 2008 | Ron Orozco

[UncleDick]

In a move that echoes a division in the Episcopal church, at least three Valley Presbyterian churches are taking steps to move to another denomination over differences about the Bible and homosexuality.

Officials at Valley congregations say they are at odds with Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.), the nation's largest Presbyterian denomination, over its decision to drop a church standard that potential ministers, deacons and elders live in "fidelity within the covenant of marriage between a man and a woman, or chastity in singleness."

[UncleDick]

First the Episcopalians and now the mainline Presbyterians in California's conservative San Joaquin Valley are preparing to split from their heretical denominations. Many Valley PCUSA churches are already members of the "Confessing Church Movement" that strongly opposes the ordination of those who are involved in openly homosexual relationships.

For background information:

Presbyterian Church USA Votes to Eliminate Proscriptions of Fornication and Non-Marital Sex

Historic split for U.S. Episcopals

[PeterFinn]

I wonder who holds the deeds to the church facilities?

[hinckley buzzard]

I wonder who holds the deeds to the church facilities?

If the embarrassing display of greed by the Piskie hierarchy is any precedent, we'll find out soon enough.

[Lee N. Field]

I wonder who holds the deeds to the church facilities?

If the embarrassing display of greed by the Piskie hierarchy is any precedent, we'll find out soon enough.

Technically, the presbytery (regional PCUSA org). Sometimes there's a fight, and it gets ugly. Sometimes it isn't.

My brother (on session now, at the PCUSA church my Dad has been a member of since the '40s, that we were all raised in) tells me that one local congregation split for the Evangelical Presbyterians, and it was all very civilized and amicable and they kept the property, so it can be done.

I think Freeper PAR35 keeps track of those goings on.

[Jack Black]

Our local Presbyterian church split off too. I think it was done without a big fight.

[PAR35]

I think Freeper PAR35 keeps track of those goings on

Someone mention my name?

Most frequently, and almost always for older properties, the deed will be in the name of the local congregation.

The presbyery and denomination claim that the ownership is actually subject to a trust in favor of the higher church courts under the PCUSA Book of Church Order.

California has been generally following a 'neutral prinicples of law' theory, under which ownership determinations are made for churches the same as they would for any other parties fighting over land - look at the deed and other documents of record.

A few states, including Oklahoma, still follow a generally disfavored theory of deferring to the highest church bosses.

Probably more info than you all wanted, but if you want more, I can keep typing for a while.