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To: wideawake
Which Scripture approves praying to anyone other than Jesus? Read 1 Tim. 2:5. So your saying Pio is dead? I understand being alive in Christ, but they are still dead to the world. The Bible is explicit that you can't reach them. Reference the rich man trying to cross the gulf to tell his family to repent. Once you pass over, you cannot communicate back here. Praying to Mary is blasphemy and if you get an answer, it's a demon, not Mary. Jesus died for the Glory of being our Mediator. To take that honor from Him is blasphemy! There is NO substitute and NO Scripture to back up the practice. In fact there are numerous verses forbidding talking to the dead. Mary is no different than Pio, or uncle Frank. Why would necromancy be illegal in the Scripture, but OK if it's the "right" person?

You are using some sort of "judgment call" to decide this woman is a heretic, but practice the same daily because you "pray" to an "approved" dead person. This is EXACTLY what Scripture forbids. It's all about Jesus, for Jesus, and no one else but Jesus. We all know Moses made it to heaven and Elijah,(Transfiguration), but do Catholics pray to them? Jesus specifically farbade the Apostles from worshiping them.

41 posted on 08/21/2008 10:43:29 AM PDT by chuckles
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To: chuckles
Which Scripture approves praying to anyone other than Jesus?

I never even suggested praying to anyone but Jesus.

Read 1 Tim. 2:5.

I have. Many times. In the original Greek as well.

So your saying Pio is dead?

No, I am saying that he's in heaven.

I understand being alive in Christ, but they are still dead to the world.

I am a Christian, and therefore do not view reality through a worldly paradigm.

The Bible is explicit that you can't reach them.

No one is talking about "reaching."

Reference the rich man trying to cross the gulf to tell his family to repent.

Was the rich man in heaven?

Once you pass over, you cannot communicate back here.

That isn't even the issue under discussion. The issue is whether people in heaven can hear me.

Praying to Mary is blasphemy and if you get an answer, it's a demon, not Mary.

No one prays to Mary. People ask Mary to pray for them.

Jesus died for the Glory of being our Mediator.

Jesus didn't die for glory. He died for love.

To take that honor from Him is blasphemy!

That's certainly a completely unrelated concern from what I am talking about.

There is NO substitute and NO Scripture to back up the practice.

The Scripture clearly shows believers asking other believers to pray for them.

In fact there are numerous verses forbidding talking to the dead.

Again we are not discussing the dead, but people to whom Christ promised life everlasting. I do not imagine that He lied in His promise.

Mary is no different than Pio, or uncle Frank.

Not according to the Scriptures she isn't.

Why would necromancy be illegal in the Scripture, but OK if it's the "right" person?

You don't seem to understand the difference between "necromancy" (conjuring up the spirit of a dead person to give you information) and "intercession" (one Christian asking another Christian to pray for them).

You are using some sort of "judgment call" to decide this woman is a heretic, but practice the same daily because you "pray" to an "approved" dead person.

Of course, I am not in the practice of praying to any mere person, let alone a dead person.

And there is no judgment call involved - this woman claims to have people who are in heaven (and even elsewhere) using her mouth and hands as a medium for speaking to people on earth. What she is talking about, in other words, is deliberate inviation to possession. That is a very clearcut sin.

This is EXACTLY what Scripture forbids.

You aren't very clear on what Scripture forbids since you seem to believe that Scripture forbids Christians asking other Christians to pray for them.

We all know Moses made it to heaven and Elijah,(Transfiguration), but do Catholics pray to them?

Catholics don't pray to anyone but God. You seem to live in an imaginary world where Catholics pray to people.

Jesus specifically farbade the Apostles from worshiping them.

The Apostles never suggested worshipping either Moses or Elijah, and Jesus never had to warn them not to.

Perhaps you could cite for us the specific verse of Scripture in which Jesus forbids the Apostles to worship Elijah or Moses.

42 posted on 08/21/2008 11:13:08 AM PDT by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
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