would you mind pinging the regulars?
When people badmouth religion, I always say that the trouble arises because there are human beings involved. Imperfect beings tend to handle things imperfectly. It's a pity that various folks worshiping the same Christ tend to hate each other so deeply over doctrine.
The inhuman cruelty and Savage barbarity to which were subjected those who dared profess the name of Christ during these centuries of heathen domination are matters of accepted history.
Referencing the period 63-305 AD. In relation to the following a little later-
The emperor (Constatine) straightway made the so-called Christianity of the time the religion of his realm;.............But the church was already in great measure an apostate institution and even in crude outline of organization and service bore but remote resemblance to the Church of Jesus Christ, founded by the Savior and builded through the instrumentality of the apostles.
The period (63-305 AD) of the martyrdom of early Christianity was one where the faith and belief of the church was very pure. Yet Talmage here denigrates the faith (so-called Christianity) of that period by saying it was already apostate. According to mormonism, isn't persecution a sign of the true church? Mormons were never thrown to the lions, nor experienced wholesale murder as the church in that period did. It is very disingenuous for Talmage to say what he did.
More to come later
Is is just me or is there far too much LDS posting going on.
Open for discussion.
Mormonism got its start about the same time melville wrote moby dick. The belief that Jesus is fully Man but not Fully God was the rage in the northeast at the time. This is a resurrection of a third century heresy called arianism. It was propounded by and Egyptian named Arius. The council of nicea convened by constantine in 324 AD ruled against it and released the nicean creed. This creed is still read in catholic and evangelical churches today. The first propounder of the arian heresy in the modern age is the unitarian church. They got their start in the 18th century in england. imho they were the result of Issac Newton’s considerable tracts in favor of the arian heresy. Newton was held in demigod status in the anglo saxon world throughout the 18th & 19th century. ie if the master says its so—it must be so. ben franklin brought a unitarian pastor over to the usa after his visit to england.
when melville finished moby dick he began attending a unitarian church. In the 19th century unitarians counted 5 presidents among their number.
That was what was in the air—the zeitgeist of the age— when joseph smith—considered religion.
So the mormons adopted the arian heresy. that is the idea that Jesus is fully Man but not fully God.
Later the Jehovah witnesses adopted the arian heresy.
In europe higher criticicm beginning in late in the 18th century achieved what the unitarians sought—the change over of christendom to the arian heresy—in Europe.
European Higher criticism made the jump to USA mainline protestant church seminaries in the 1890’s. By 1930 most mainline protestant church seminaries had been converted over to some form of arianism.
This is the difference between liberal protestants and evangelical protestants. The liberals hold jesus to a lower status. a nice man.
In europe arianism left the church vulnerable to attacks by atheists. nietzche’s dad was a protestant minister at the time when arianism was all the rage in germany. the problem with arianism is that it robs the church of any power but what assorted members can gin up by main strength. christianity today has collapsed in europe.
mainline protestant churches are head in the same direction as their european cousins.
Only evangelical churches are seeing their numbers grow.
The exception is the mormons.
the great virtue of the mormons is that they have figured out how to compensate with genius organization what they lack in great theology.
One assertion can be reasonably debated. An essay length screed of vile, disgusting slander, hatred and bile can only be scoffed at and dismissed.
"Foreseen and predicted" by whom, and where?
One wonders why Jesus even bothered, when his work was so thoroughly corrupted before the Apostles' bodies had even cooled off. What a failure!
The idea of a universal apostasy makes the whole of the Gospels into the ravings of a deluded idiot ("I will be with you always ... I will send the Paraclete, who will lead you to all truth ... I will not leave you orphans ... upon this rock I will found my church ..."), which I suppose is exactly the point.