DR. PUSEY ON THE WORSHIP OF MARY IN THE CHURCH OF ROME

Sword and the Trowel ^ | 1866 | Charles Spurgeon

[Ransomed]

Everything on your list is admitted to by some Catholics who do/believe those things that are against Catholic teaching. Why don’t Catholics admit to Mary worship?

Freegards

[tiki]

I haven’t read too far but I guess it IS okay to say that Presbyterians sacrifice virgins and drink the blood and we don’t have to have any proof for that nor take any supposed proof from them, It is so because we say it is so?

And I further surmise that as long as a quote is not actually attributed to a certain non-mentionable name it is okay for him to be quoted.

[sevenbak]

Hi Resty. As much as I'd love to defend my faith from those who have hijacked yet another anti religion thread to make it into another anti Mormon thread, I'll pass. I prefer not to join a thread which intent seems to be in bashing others’ religions. I leave that to the Anti Mormon FReepers.

Reading forward, you might tell those you are arguing with about the 12 Apostles sitting in Judgment in heaven on all the 12 tribes who they had stewardship and Apostleship over. They were witnesses of Christ, and their mission was to testify of Him, thus washing their garments clean, or in other words, fulfilling the responsibility that Christ gave to them, in testifying of Him.

Joseph was not different, and His dispensation/stewardship is similar, as it has been in all periods of time when God has had His servants on earth, testifying of Him.

I know I'm preaching to the choir, this isn't for you, but I won't be joining this thread, just this post.

Have fun.

[Judith Anne]

Erm...heh-heh.

Probably.

[trisham]

I haven’t read too far but I guess it IS okay to say that Presbyterians sacrifice virgins and drink the blood and we don’t have to have any proof for that nor take any supposed proof from them, It is so because we say it is so?

*******************

Exactly. Don't forget, at the same time we should also piously tell them we're praying for their souls.

[OLD REGGIE]

I'm starting to wonder if you know what actual worship is.

I'm beginning to wonder if you are able to sort out the highly specialized Catholic Dictionary. When does "worship" mean "worship" and when does it mean something else?

"For to be right and good, worship of the Mother of God ought to spring from the heart; acts of the body have here neither utility nor value if the acts of the soul have no part in them. Now these latter can only have one object, which is that we should fully carry out what the divine Son of Mary commands. For if true love alone has the power to unite the wills of men, it is of the first necessity that we should have one will with Mary to serve Jesus our Lord. What this most prudent Virgin said to the servants at the marriage feast of Cana she addresses also to us: "Whatsoever he shall say to you, do ye" (John ii., 5). Now here is the word of Jesus Christ: "If you would enter into life, keep the commandments" (Mt. xix., 17). Let them each one fully convince himself of this, that if his piety towards the Blessed Virgin does not hinder him from sinning, or does not move his will to amend an evil life, it is a piety deceptive and lying, wanting as it is in proper effect and its natural fruit." (Ad diem illum laetissimum, Feb 2, 1904: para. 17)

(Link at my post #501. Nobody has seen fit to respond.)

[Petrosius]

What I (and others) have said is that whatever you want to call the ritual of venerating Mary, it is worship to us; we see it as worship (regardless of what you call it)...

But for it to be worship you need to know the internal disposition of the soul. You are judging from external appearances only. At first sight it is understandable that you might think that this is worship. But when the person tells you that it is not, that he attributes nothing divine to Mary, that all he intends is to show his love of one of God's creature, then you should take him at his word and move on.

[OLD REGGIE]

See #501.

[Iscool]

Interesting. Thanks. So there are two now who acknowledge they interpret Scripture for themselves.

What foolishness...The one that's doing the private interpretation against God's will is the Catholic church...That's where you get your information...

I believe what I read in the Scripture, whether I understand it or not...I read the context...I compare with other Scriptures that pertain to the same topic...And, I ask the Holy Spirit to guide and teach me...

Now if you are one of those Christians who is NOT led by the Holy Spirit in reading and understanding Scripture, I can see why you would take the position you do...

Before I was saved, I didn't have a clue what was in the Scriptures, even tho I could read it...

[Iscool]

There is no teaching of the RCC which is so clear it cannot be denied, modified, or reinterpreted as required.

Sad, but true...

[OLD REGGIE]

Seems like a perfect opportunity for you to expain these things, to clear the matter up...

Or to explain the necessity the invention of such a highly specialized language in the first place.

[Petrosius]

YOU may not personally worship her, Judith Anne, but there ARE those who do, especially in foreign lands. We’ve seen it time and time again. I’m glad you personally don’t because it’s not a good thing to put her above her Son. Love, M

No, you have seen external actions that to you appeared to be worship. Did you actually question those concerned and ask them if they worshipped Mary? Did you ask them if they considered Mary a god? If not, then to attribute to them that they were indeed worshipping Mary would be rash judgment.

[Marysecretary]

Yes, we’ve been given the freedom by God to do just that.

[Marysecretary]

If you are not filled with the Holy Spirit, the Bible is just another book with no real meaning. You can recite all the verses you want, but they will have no real meaning without His Holy Spirit. It’s like singing hymns before you are saved: just by rote, pretty, but wow, when you’re saved, they have a whole new meaning.

[Petronski]

There is no teaching of the RCC which is so clear it cannot be denied, modified, or reinterpreted as required to smear, misrepresent and otherwise lie about Catholic teachings.

[Marysecretary]

Because they most sincerely do not believe they are worshipping her.

[tiki]

Good observation.

[MarkBsnr]

***If watering it down does in fact require water, I suggest you drill a deep well.***

I suspect that there is not enough water in all the oceans.

[OLD REGGIE]

>>Is that not what Protestants do when they accuse Catholic of worshipping Mary or treating as God when we strongly object that we do not? << Well that’s what I think, but the people here and maybe the Mod think differntly.

I'm surprised at you Mom. You are aware, as are your 5th graders, that Catholic is singular.

I think the correct answer is "which Catholic"?

[DungeonMaster]

I know that you truly believe that some worship Mary due to the Catholic Church’s teaching. Do you have any theories as to why the CATHOLIC Church would want to have unknowing Mary worship and not real knowing worship? If you had to hazard a guess, what would you say? Do Catholics know they worship Mary? If they know they worship Mary, why wouldn’t they admit it?

I think the RCC doctrines are a product of the enemy. The bible warns about the enemy invading "the body of Christ" not to be confused with RC teaching that it IS the Church. I think these doctrines are the example of "Damnable heresies" mentioned in the bible. It seems that many of the warnings in the bible are aimed at the RCC and many of it's teachings.