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To: Petronski; Dr. Eckleburg

To Dr. Eckleburg’s comments, I would add John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: 13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Is that clear enough? Born again, saved unto life eternal, converted, et al. - not of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

Paul makes this explicitly clear in Romans 9:
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
9 For this is the word of promise, At this time will I come, and Sarah shall have a son.
10 And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;
11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)
12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

God is SOVEREIGN.


455 posted on 04/03/2008 6:25:28 PM PDT by Manfred the Wonder Dawg (Test ALL things, hold to that which is True.)
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To: Manfred the Wonder Dawg

That’s nice. What’s your point. Do you have one?


456 posted on 04/03/2008 6:28:18 PM PDT by OpusatFR
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To: Manfred the Wonder Dawg

John 1

Love this! Memorized it from the Latin Mass.

Just read. It sings!

“In the beginning was the Word (Logos) and the Word was with God; and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him was made nothing that has been made. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. And the light shines in the darkness; and the darkness grasped it not. There was a man, one sent from God, whose name was John. This man came as a witness, to bear witness concerning the Light, that all might believe through Him. He was not himself the Light, but was to bear witness to the Light. It was the true Light that enlightens every man who comes into the world. He was in the world and the world was made by Him and the world knew Him not. He came unto His own, and His own received Him not. But to as many as received Him, He gave the power of becoming sons of God; to those who believe in His name: who were born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man but of God. AND THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, and dwelt among us. And we saw His glory, the glory as of the Only-begotten of the Father, full of grace and of truth. Thanks be to God.

The prayer said after Mass in TLM.

This one I know I know by heart.

And of course, we know that the Word, the Logos was Christ carried in the womb of the Blessed Mother who visited Elizabeth her cousin who carried John the Baptist, of the John in this prayer, who greeted Mary with this statement:

Luke:1-39

” During those days, Mary set out andtraveled to the hill country in haste to a town of Judah, where she entered the house of Zechariah and greeted Elizabeth. When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the infant leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth, filled with the HOLY SPIRIT cried out in a loud voice and said, “Most blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your womb. And how does this happen to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? For at the moment the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the infant in my womb leaped for joy.

Blessed are you who believed that was spoken to you by the Lord would be fulfilled.”

Blessed are you...is Luke’s affirmation of Mary’s role as believer and in explicit mention of Mary’s presence in the upper room and among the Apostles after the Resurrection.


462 posted on 04/03/2008 7:04:20 PM PDT by OpusatFR
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To: Manfred the Wonder Dawg
Is that clear enough?

Of course it is clear enough. It just doesn't say what you claim.

God is SOVEREIGN.

Whom do you imagine disagrees?

473 posted on 04/03/2008 7:43:06 PM PDT by Petronski (Nice job, Hillary. Now go home and get your shine box.)
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