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To: OLD REGGIE
III. NUNS PROPERLY SO CALLED

Nuns properly so-called have solemn vows with a strict enclosure, regulated by pontifical law which prevents the religious from going out (except in very rare cases, approved by the regular superior and the bishop), and also the entrance of strangers, even females, under pain of excommunication. Even admission to the grated parlor is not free, and interviews with regulars are subject to stringent rules. Though some mitigations have been introduced partly by local usage, partly (in the case of certain convents in America) by express concession of the Holy See. The building should be so arranged that the inner courts and gardens cannot be overlooked from outside, and the windows should not open on the public road. By the fact of their enclosure, these monasteries are independent of one another. At the head of the community is a superior often called the abbess, appointed for life by the chapter, at least outside Italy, for in Italy, and especially in the two Sicilies, the constitution "Exposcit debitum" (1 January, 1583) of Gregory XIII requires that hey should be re-elected every three years (see "Periodica de Religiosis", n. 420, vol. 4, 158). The election must be confirmed by the prelate to whom the monastery is subject, the pope, the bishop,or the regular prelate. The bishop presides over the ballot, except in the case of nuns subject to regulars, and he has always the right to be present at the election. The president collects the votes at the grating. Without having jurisdiction, the abbess exercises authority over all in the house, and commands in virtue of their vows. Monasteries not exempt are subject to the jurisdiction of the bishop; exempt monasteries are placed, some under the immediate authority of the Holy See, others under that of a regular First Order. In the absence of any other formal direction, the Holy See is understood to delegate to the bishop the annual visitation of monasteries immediately subject to the pope, to the exclusion of other superiors. This visitation is made by the regular prelate in the case of monasteries dependent on a First Order; but the bishop has in all cases authority to insist on the maintenance of the enclosure, and to control the temporal administration; he also approves the confessors.

The erection of a monastery requires the consent of the bishop, and (at least in practice nowadays) of the Holy See. The bishop, by himself, or in consultation with the regular superior, determines the number of nuns who can be received according to the amount of their ordinary revenues. The recent Council of Bishop of Latin America, at Rome in 1899, required that the number should not be less than twelve. It is sometimes permitted to receive a certain number of supernumeraries who pay a double dowry, never less than four hundred crowns, and remain supernumeraries all their lives. According to the decree of 23 May, 1659, candidates must be at least fifteen years old. The decree "Sanctissimus" of 4 January, 1910, annuls the admission to the novitiate or to any vows, if granted without the consent of the Holy See, of pupils expelled for any grave reason from a secular school, or for any reason whatever from any institution preparatory to the religious life, or of former novices or professed sisters expelled from their convents. Professed sisters dispensed from their vows cannot, without the consent of the Holy See, enter any congregation, but the one they have quitted (see NOVICE; POSTULANT; "Periodica de Religiosis", n. 368, vol. 5, 98). The admission is made by the chapter, but, before the clothing, and also before the solemn profession, it is the duty of the bishop, by himself or (if he is prevented) by his vicar-general or some person delegated by either of them, to inquire into the question of the candidate's religious vocation, and especially as to her freedom of choice. The candidate must provide a dowry of at least two hundred crowns unless the founder consents to accept a smaller sum. With certain exceptions, the dowry of choir sisters cannot be dispensed with; it must be paid before the clothing, and invested in some safe and profitable manner. On solemn profession, it becomes the property of the convent, which has, however, no right of alienation; it is returned as a matter of equity to a religious who enters another order, or to one who returns to the world and is in want.

After the novitiate the religious cannot at first, according to the decree "Perpensis" of 3 May, 1902, take any but simple vows whether perpetual or for a year only, if it is customary to take annual vows. The admission to vows is made by the chapter, with the consent of the regular superior or the bishop. Some writers hold that the bishop is bound, before this profession, to make a fresh inquiry into the vocation of the novice, and this inquiry does not dispense from that which the Council of Trent prescribes before solemn profession (see the answer of 19 January, 1909; "Periodica de Religiosis", n. 317, vol. 4, 341.) This period of simple vows ordinarily lasts for three years, but the bishop or the regular prelate may prolong it in the case of nuns who are under twenty-five years. During this period, the religious keeps her property, but makes over the administration of it to any one she may choose. She is bound to the rules and the choir, but not to the private recitation of the Divine Office; she can take part in chapters, except in those in which others are admitted to vows; she cannot be elected superior, mother-vicaress, mistress of novices, assistant, counsellor, or treasurer. She participates in all the indulgences and spiritual privileges of those who have taken their solemn vows; and although the solemnly professed take precedence, once the solemn profession is made, the seniority is regulated by the date of simple profession, without regard to any delay in proceeding to solemn profession. The dispensation of vows and dismissal of nuns are reserved to the Holy See. The outward solemnity of profession takes place at the first simple profession, the other takes place without any solemnity. Only the prelate or the ordinary can admit to the latter, but a consultative chapter is held, whose decision is announced by the superior. Solemn profession carries with it the inability to possess property (except in case of a papal indult such as that enjoyed by Belgium and perhaps Holland), annuls a marriage previously contracted but not consummated, and creates a diriment impediment to any subsequent marriage. Nuns are generally obliged to recite the Divine office, like religious orders of men; but the Visitandines and some monasteries of Ursulines recite only the ..

Much more here:http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/11164a.htm

53 posted on 03/27/2008 3:16:04 PM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: trisham
As I said upthread:

Folks ignorant about Catholicism will no doubt be very poor liars about Catholicism.

57 posted on 03/27/2008 3:19:14 PM PDT by Petronski (Nice job, Hillary. Now go home and get your shine box.)
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To: trisham
From reading what you offer here, from

it certainly does appear that she could not be *properly* called a nun, yet you left out other references, the very ones she alluded to, which are parts that include exceptions to this seemingly all inclusive regulation.

Mary Ann Collins writes;

Then adds at the bottom of the page;

NOTE

_________________________________________________________________ __________________________________________________________________ Looking for what novices might be;

In case we don't know what a plenary indulgence is, ( i didn't) then there can be reference found here;

Searching for what a regular might be, we find at;

This excerpt, if I may;

Now this portion does talk about vows, and how the lack of by the novices seemingly had been a topic of discussion in previous times. Yet the ending sentence is the one Mary Jo refers to, along with the one which mentions plenary indulgence granted upn the day of entry.

So her stated claim, to be a nun "only in the wider sense" can be seen to apply in the brevity of her circumstance ( two years), which does appear to have been an direct consideration of the writers, judging from the general leadings of the texts here referenced and highlighted.

Please note;
She claims in the above article, and in the note attached at the bottom, to be a nun only in the wider meaning of the word.

Since it is established that novices can be considered regulars albiet only in the widest sense, [as she herself took pains to note] and a regular be a nun, again in only the widest sense, acknowledged again, along with the mention of plenary indulence, upon the FIRST DAY of admittance, then it indeed can be honestly argued she was a nun!

...other claims and definitions of Nuns in general, not withstanding.

[all highlighting of font and text my own, the bold & red
to point out the chain of reasoning, the purple, to highlight the grace given, even under your own laws, from the beginning. Which grace leads (it could be argued for her) in an unbroken chain, to now. Isn't that wonderful?]

This thread's title is


81 posted on 03/27/2008 9:16:29 PM PDT by BlueDragon (here's the thing; do recognize the bell of truth when you here it ring, c'mon and sing it children)
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