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To: annalex
What can we say to the second group? If they acknowledge the authority of the Early Church, but reject the Catholic authority today, then they should be able to (1) point out where the Catholic Church of today separated herself from the Early Church

I'd say right there in the 1st Century...

2Co 2:17 For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God: but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.

For one thing, he wanted to warn them not to be taken in by phony "inspired truth." And so he told them clearly how to recognize a genuine epistle from him: it would be signed in his own handwriting: "I, Paul, write this greeting with my own hand, and this is a distinguishing mark in every letter; this is the way I write" (3:17). He wanted to ensure that they would not be fooled again by forged epistles.

There's no reason to believe that your church fathers that you cite are not the same people Paul is referring to in his epistles...

As the article states, there is no evidence of Apostolic succession in the scriptures but these 'fathers' of yours promote their own apostolic succession...

38 posted on 03/27/2008 8:53:27 AM PDT by Iscool
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To: Iscool
As the article states, there is no evidence of Apostolic succession in the scriptures

So when Paul and his co-workers appoint overseers (Gk episcopoi, bishops) "in every town", if that's not apostolic succession, what is it?

41 posted on 03/27/2008 10:45:32 AM PDT by Campion
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To: Iscool
I'd say right there in the 1st Century

But...but...I thought the Catholic Church only began with Constantine in the 4th Century! Are you suddenly acknowledging that the Catholic Church has roots that can be found nearly 300 years earlier? Which is it?

46 posted on 03/27/2008 11:15:35 AM PDT by magisterium
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To: Iscool
no reason to believe that your church fathers that you cite are not the same people Paul is referring to

No reason to believe that they are either. The truth is that the early Christians left us a great deal of material, some of it heretical and some -- not. To attach a single verdict to all of them is absurd. Often an authority is accepted but partly, such as Origen or Tertullian. Still, there is a core of thinkers who formed the mind of the Church in 2-3cc and that is the same Church that also produced the Canon of scripture, so if you believe in the scripture you better believe in what they wrote at least where they express views held catholically (i.e. commonly).

there is no evidence of Apostolic succession in the scriptures

Sure there is. "Go ye teach every nation"; "Do this in memory of me", "He who hears you hears me", "I send you as my father sent me", "How can they preach unless they are sent?", "do not impose your hands lightly on any man" -- any of that sound familiar?

55 posted on 03/27/2008 5:13:01 PM PDT by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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