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To: annalex; Alex Murphy; blue-duncan; wmfights; Quix; Alamo-Girl; Gamecock
INSTITUTES OF THE CHRISTIAN RELIGION
CHAPTER 7
THE TESTIMONY OF THE SPIRIT…

"Nothings therefore can be more absurd than the fiction, that the power of judging Scripture is in the Church, and that on her nod its certainty depends. When the Church receives it, and gives it the stamp of her authority, she does not make that authentic which was otherwise doubtful or controverted but, acknowledging it as the truth of God, she, as in duty bounds shows her reverence by an unhesitating assent. As to the question, How shall we be persuaded that it came from God without recurring to a decree of the Church? it is just the same as if it were asked, How shall we learn to distinguish light from darkness, white from black, sweet from bitter? Scripture bears upon the face of it as clear evidence of its truth, as white and black do of their colour, sweet and bitter of their taste...

IOW, spirit recognizes spirit.

57 posted on 03/24/2008 11:03:50 PM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
Ok...I'm trying to sort through this whole thread. I ask this only as a point of clairification, no more.

Under your "Spirit recognizes Spirit" reasoning, what would be the outcome of the hypothetical below?

A 25 year old man has lived on a tropical island alone for as far as he can remember. Assume he was baptized as a child (thus removing any impediments of Original Sin). He lives an idyllic life, perfectly content. One day, a crate of 100 books appears on his beach. This crate contains, individually bound, the 77 books of Catholic canon. It also contains - the Koran, some Vedic scriptures, Augustine's Confessions, The Summa Theologica, Nichomachean Ethics, Oprah's The Secret, and a bunch of the Christian books recognized as non-Canon (Infancy Gospel, Gospel of Thomas, etc.). Each book in this crate is bound with the same material, and no markings indicate which is which.

Ok, so, my question is, if this man alone found this crate and sincerely desired to know how to live his life, what books would he choose? Am I correct in assuming you believe he would pull the 66 books chosen by Calvin? Again, I am just asking this to clarify my own understanding - nothing more.

79 posted on 03/25/2008 6:22:02 AM PDT by thefrankbaum
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To: Dr. Eckleburg; Alex Murphy; blue-duncan; wmfights; Quix; Alamo-Girl; Gamecock
Each time you post from Calvin I get a thrill that a hawk must feel spotting a field mouse. Thanks.

Let us quote a bit above what you quote:

Paul testifies that the Church is “built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets,” (Eph. 2:20). If the doctrine of the apostles and prophets is the foundation of the Church, the former must have had its certainty before the latter began to exist. Nor is there any room for the cavil, that though the Church derives her first beginning from thence, it still remains doubtful what writings are to be attributed to the apostles and prophets, until her Judgment is interposed. For if the Christian Church was founded at first on the writings of the prophets, and the preaching of the apostles, that doctrine, wheresoever it may be found, was certainly ascertained and sanctioned antecedently to the Church, since, but for this, the Church herself never could have existed. Nothings therefore can be more absurd than the fiction, that the power of judging Scripture is in the Church, and that on her nod its certainty depends.

Ch. 7

So, the Church is built on the foundation of prophets and apostles and for that reason she authenticates the scripture. Very well. That is the Catholic teaching. Conveniently, you posted in 58 form 1 Corinthians 2:10-12; you might have added the stronger lagnuage St. Paul employs later, "But we have the mind of Christ". With this scriptural foundation in mind, we are equipped to answer the question, who is that royal, Christ-minded "we", who "have received not the spirit of this world, but the Spirit that is of God; that we may know the things that are given us from God"? You, "doctor"? Mr. Calvin? Rev. Huckster?

St. Paul gives a direct answer:

the sensual man perceiveth not these things that are of the Spirit of God; for it is foolishness to him, and he cannot understand, because it is spiritually examined. 15 But the spiritual man judgeth all things; and he himself is judged of no man. [...] 1 And I, brethren, could not speak to you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal. As unto little ones in Christ. 2 I gave you milk to drink, not meat; for you were not able as yet. But neither indeed are you now able; for you are yet carnal.

(Ibid)

Christianity consists of the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, who speaks the mind of Christ, and it consists of "the little ones in Christ", the laity. So how is it then that Mr. Calvin proceeds in his book "Scripture bears upon the face of it as clear evidence of its truth, as white and black do of their colour"? Who made that man an apostle? This, "doctor" is ugly, lying arrogance that permeates the Institutes, in all its rabid empty froth.
177 posted on 03/25/2008 9:50:59 AM PDT by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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