Posted on 03/01/2008 7:26:21 AM PST by Alex Murphy
Not everybody has to learn that stuff -- and nobody understands it.
From my POV, it's like this: There was something amazing in history almost 2k years ago. It reaches into our hearts and messes around with us. At some point it elicits from us a response of self-commitment, which those who are said to "make" tend to feel like it "was made" "in and for" them, by a kind of gift.
But the gift is on a delayed fuse, or is like one of those time release pills. It is, in one sense given all at once, and in another sense giving again and again with new aspects at each giving.
Then somebody says, "Woah! WHAT was THAT?"
And theology begins. But the subject matter of theology is too big for theologians. We just like throwing ourselves against it to celebrate our smallness in the face of its huge wonder.
But not all are called to theology, though a little theology is good for nearly all of us, I think, and it's a fine way to praise God. But only a very little is "required", and it's not really required of all Catholics. Some live it, so they don't have to talk about it. We incompetents talk, and maybe there is praise for God in that.
“After reading your entire post I understand why I am not a Catholic.”
Grunthor,
I can tell from what you write that you have a lot of charity in your heart.
The one thing I would ask is if you could get a copy of Eusibius’ History of the Church. He was an historian in the second and third centuries and wrote about what they did in the early Church. It is absolutely amazing. This man did not have an axe to grind he was reporting (quite drly at times) about the events happening before and around him.
It is available on Amazon and it was quite reasonable in price. I am glad to see you on your spiritual search.
Regards,
Lurking’
Catholicism is not a “feel good” faith that has entertainment at the weekly church services. We are a sacramental church. We all acknowledge our sinfulness and need for daily repentance.
One of the big charges against the Catholic Church is that Catholics are made to have “guilt trips”. I prefer to say that Catholics are expected to develop good consciences and then to live their lives by it.
There are many reasons why Catholics no longer go to church. Some are poor catechesis, some are people who prefer good oration to sacramental graces; and some are just plain laziness on the part of many who will not go to any church on Sunday - or will not read the bible on their own.
If they’d continue to go to church regularly they would get plenty of exposure to the Gospel, Epistles, Psalms and other books of the O.T. as well. Additionally they would participate in the Holy Eucharist. Instead they complain, but never offer to help the church out.
?What we so often get is people coming up to us compassionately or aggressively and attacking us or commiserating with us because they are just persuaded that we believe something that we don’t believe and do something we don’t do. It gets old.”
I know the feeling. Some people think that just because I am a member of the Assemblies of God church, that I babble in “tongues” and fall on the floor an flop around in church....assumptions cause more strife and pain in this world than facts.
I was ready to enroll my children in Catholic High School but the only Catholic schools are located in the inner cities.
The Catholic Church needs to start more schools in the suburbs, where the children actually live.
The nuns say, “Give us your children and we’ll have them forever.”
So. . .my baptized Catholic children are now attending a Lutheran school.
Rather, they must depart to find someone who will preach that those are the only things necessary.
“I am glad to see you on your spiritual search.”
I am not really “searching” for I have found where it is that I am called to be.....I do enjoy learning about other folks’ belief systems, rather than going on rumor or innuendo. I cannpt really ever see myself leaving the church that I am in for a Catholic or any other....I just really enjoy the back and forth.
Thank you for the info and for the kind words.
Amen
(Pssst! Got any spare snakes?)
heh heh heh/
Astute analysis.
It comes from lots of experiences off-line. Then I did some reading (very little) about personality disorders, but with a concentration on Narcissistic Personality disorder and Borderline Personality disorder - an illness which will tear your heart out and barbecue it. And I've had a little experience, but not counseling experience, with histrionic personality disorder. (And I always have an MD pshrink as my backstop and referee. It's hard to keep one's footing without some professional homies.
Then I had a "flash": that chemically dependent people and personality disorder people are very similar, and both illnesses are very intractable, Even the best therapies have pretty lousy records.
But this was "seasoned" by my acquaintance with a recovering alcoholic who had "been working the program (AA)" for a dozen years, and was one of the most virtuous (as far as I could tell) and most spiritual people I ever met. So there is hope.
I'm working on whether one useful way to think about personality disorders would be to use the addiction metaphor in this way: PD sufferers are addicted to the reactions of other people the way substance abusers are dependent on their "substance".
And where "religion" plays into it is best exemplified by the great and unforgettable Cheech and Chong line,"I used to be all messed up on drugs, but now I'm all messed up on the Lord."
When I went up on the Psych ward in the Bullfinch Building at Mass General the patients glommed onto me. "Religion" (and in the US that usually means some form of Christianity) provides wonderful "cover and concealment" for various kinds of illness -- as do many of the "helping" professions, including being a clergy-dude and being some kind of pshrink.
You gotta pay attention. Back when I was smoking and taking care of a church while the pastor was on sabbatical, a lady who described herself as Spirit-filled stomped into my office, grabbed my cigarette out of my hand, and smashed it in the ash-tray.
Now whose needs was THAT supposed to serve? Of course, she could excuse it by saying she was a prophet and that was a prophetic "sign". Sounds good. But I'm not buying.
Then you have the ethical problem of when does "offering it up" become a kind of "enabling".
This is the kind of thing that keeps life interesting.
(Pssst! Got any spare snakes?)
Smart alec, LOL!
Man, ain't that the truth. I remember back in high school, the "Jesus Freaks" were all former dopers. They were trying to substitute one high for another.
My guess it that most of them have had quite a few more bouts with dope or other substances by this point in their lives. I hope not, but most likely the case all the same.
When a religion of millions loses 100,000, and a Religion of 100,000 loses 50,000....who has REALLY lost more.
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