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To: farmer18th
Moses never asked the people to do something objectively evil, something that was beyond question, outside the revealed will of the Lord, and you have no basis for saying I would propose any such thing at all, or that I would be the one to determine what is right or wrong.

Earlier you stated that MacArthur would have made a good "jew-killing Nazi Lutheran" (post 20). Tell me what MacArthur is asking the people to do that is "objectively evil"? Fact is there isn't anything. The only thing you're criticizing him for is that he is stating that we should obey authority and he's using Romans 13 as his text.

I would say the number of times I have seen MacArthur on television, he has ALWAYS defended the gospel and stated honestly and openly what the gospel is. This is far more than I can say for people like Rick Warren, Joel Osteen and, yes, even Billy Graham.

Earlier you seemed to admit that there are occasions when higher laws are obeyed over lower ones. Don't let your defense of a mere man--John MacArthur--cloud your defense of scripture.

The ONLY time we are to obey the "higher laws" are when they conflict with our relationship with God. Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego were willing to serve King Nebuchadnezzar and act as his advisors carrying out his laws-as reprehensible as they were. However, they were not willing to bow down to a golden statue he had made. There are limits but they have to do with spiritual limits-not legal ones. Like abortion in the US, we can (and should) vote against it, but that is where our authority ends. The responsibility rest with those who carry it out.

122 posted on 02/18/2008 5:14:55 PM PST by HarleyD
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To: HarleyD
Earlier you stated that MacArthur would have made a good "jew-killing Nazi Lutheran" (post 20). Tell me what MacArthur is asking the people to do that is "objectively evil"?

When he gives sermons without qualification, saying "Obey Hitler," "Obey Caligula," that is very much what he is paving the way for. The sermon posted above is a very good indication why "submission" does not always mean abject obedience. Your wife owes you submission, but if you ask her to murder for you, she does not owe you obedience. You, and MacArthur, can't hide behind a coward's absolutist interpretation of Romans 13. If a ruler tells you to kill someone, and you know you are not executing a just sentence, the sin will be upon your head.
123 posted on 02/18/2008 5:24:08 PM PST by farmer18th (Conservatives who vote McCain are like abused dogs who keep licking their master's hand...)
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