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To: MarkBsnr; ScubieNuc; Quix; Lord_Calvinus; wmfights; HarleyD; Forest Keeper; the_conscience; ...
The Holy Spirit is beyond us.

Oh, Mark, my heart grieves for you.

The Holy Spirit is alive and well and indwelling every one of Christ's sheep, by the grace and purpose and mercy of God alone.

"And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.

For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a fish give him a serpent?

Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion?

If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?" -- Luke 11:9-13

It's the gift of Holy Spirit within us that even makes you want to knock at the door of Christ. If you don't believe Christ's promise to you, would you believe Augustine?

"The grace of God does not find men fit to be elected, but makes them so..."

"The nature of the Divine goodness is not only to open to those that knock, but also to cause them to knock and ask."

This is the expressed purpose of the Holy Spirit -- to open our eyes and ears and give us a new heart and lead us in sanctification toward obedience and gratitude to Jesus Christ alone.

If you miss that, you've missed so much.

This was one of the primary goals of the Reformation -- to restore the Holy Spirit in the church and in men's minds to His rightful place as the means and method of men receiving God's grace through faith in Christ. The reformers went back to the Bible and read for themselves that the gift of the Holy Spirit is given to individuals who then make up the church of God on earth. Rome has worked to usurp the role of Holy Spirit for centuries.

As if it possibly could.

Thankfully, we have God's word that the Holy Spirit is not "beyond us," but within us by the grace and purpose and will of God alone.

"What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?" -- 1 Corinthians 6:19

Paul is asking YOU that question, Mark.

685 posted on 01/31/2008 9:56:09 AM PST by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg; MarkBsnr; ScubieNuc; Quix; Lord_Calvinus; wmfights; HarleyD; Forest Keeper; ...
It saddens me when the ministry of the indwelling Spirit is understated. Of a Truth, if a man does not have the Spirit indwelling him, he is not one of Christ’s. Emphasis mine:

[There is] therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. For to be carnally minded [is] death; but to be spiritually minded [is] life and peace. Because the carnal mind [is] enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. – Romans 8:9

To God be the glory, not man, never man.

705 posted on 01/31/2008 10:56:23 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Dr. Eckleburg

***MB: The Holy Spirit is beyond us.

Dr. E.: Oh, Mark, my heart grieves for you.

The Holy Spirit is alive and well and indwelling every one of Christ’s sheep, by the grace and purpose and mercy of God alone.***

I thank you for the sentiment. What I meant is that God is our Creator and we are His creatures. He is beyond us further than we are beyond rotifers. Your statement on the Holy Spirit is correct, by the way.

Your quotation of Luke is, as well. Congratulations on finding it.

***It’s the gift of Holy Spirit within us that even makes you want to knock at the door of Christ.***

Correct again.

***This is the expressed purpose of the Holy Spirit — to open our eyes and ears and give us a new heart and lead us in sanctification toward obedience and gratitude to Jesus Christ alone.***

And again.

***This was one of the primary goals of the Reformation — to restore the Holy Spirit in the church and in men’s minds to His rightful place as the means and method of men receiving God’s grace through faith in Christ.***

The primary goal of the Reformation was power. The Reformers restored the Holy Spirit nowhere; He does as He does and does not need permissions of men, especially those who would spurn His Church.

We do not understand God - in that way He is beyond us (unless you believe that you become God). But yes, He is there, holding out His gift of grace and the hope of salvation, if we would only receive it.


714 posted on 01/31/2008 11:17:53 AM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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