If you are referring to Acts 17:11 re: Bearean Jews, that's a joke. What Scriptures did they consult? I would imagine the Septuagint, because they were Hellenized Jews. They were checking to see if Paul was quoting from it.
Since he spoke in the synagogue, the Berean rabbis naturally checked to see if his words were correct, and even then not all of them believed him.
Why? Because Paul quotes from all over the place, takes a little from here and a little from there, and makes up his own prophesy. It's sad to say this, but it is glaringly obvious by checkered makeup of his statements.
Take for instance 1 Cor 15:4 "and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures." The part "raised on the third day" is from Matthew (16:21), Acts (2:31) and John (2:20). But Matthew, Acts and especially John were not written at the time Paul wrote this Epistle to the Corinthians!!! Hello, earth, we have a problem, bleep.
Kosta: What about those who “believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away” (Luke 8:13)? According to you they never believed...but Christ is quoted as saying otherwise.
FK: If you read Christ that way, you have Him saying that there can be true faith with no root.
Hey, FK, this is not some kind of a mumbo-jumbo puzzle made up of various OT/NT quotes, but a straight sentence, and presented as something Jesus actually said. If you have a problem with what it says, then examine your conscience, but from what you say it seems that you are expressing doubt that the verse is true because it clashes with your beliefs.
The verse is clear: it says that there are those who believe for a while and you are saying that they never believed. It's not about a root, but about losing faith and falling away, because nöetic beings can choose. No one is compelled to love God.
Does that sound like something Christ would teach?
The verse says we can believe for a while and then fall away by temptation. As regards works-based salvation, yes the Gospels have Christ teaching works-based salvation all over the place. What else could He preach, being an observant Jew, and preaching to the Jews?!?
If you are referring to Acts 17:11 re: Bearean Jews, that's a joke. What Scriptures did they consult? I would imagine the Septuagint, because they were Hellenized Jews. They were checking to see if Paul was quoting from it.
Of what possible relevance could it be whether or not they read the Septuagint? You act as if that would be absolutely critical to their understanding. Wrong, and totally off point. The point is that you were attacking the scriptures and I said that Paul taught that they should be consulted above oral teaching.
Take for instance 1 Cor 15:4 "and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures." The part "raised on the third day" is from Matthew (16:21), Acts (2:31) and John (2:20). But Matthew, Acts and especially John were not written at the time Paul wrote this Epistle to the Corinthians!!! Hello, earth, we have a problem, bleep.
Ridiculous. You leave out:
Mark 9:30-31 : 30 They left that place and passed through Galilee. Jesus did not want anyone to know where they were, 31 because he was teaching his disciples. He said to them, "The Son of Man is going to be betrayed into the hands of men. They will kill him, and after three days he will rise."
There is absolutely no way you can sell it as a certainty that Mark was not written and known to Paul before 1 Cor. No way.
FK: Does that sound like something Christ would teach?
The verse says we can believe for a while and then fall away by temptation. As regards works-based salvation, yes the Gospels have Christ teaching works-based salvation all over the place. What else could He preach, being an observant Jew, and preaching to the Jews?!?
OK, then you work as hard as you can for your salvation and I will have faith for mine. :)