FK: Then either God erred or God needed Paul's help.
You can word it any way you want: the Church was dying in Israel and it actually died. The Christians were kicked out of the synagogues (as Jesus said they would) and persecuted by Romans and Jews. Paul tried at first the Jews in diaspora but when that didn't work he turned to the Gentiles.
There is nothing, absolutely nothing, in the Bible that even suggests the Gentiles are to be included as a (second-class) "branch." The Jews do not proselytize. And Hebrews 8 is clear that there will be no need for preaching and teaching. But then again this runs into conflict with other NT authors. Nothing new.
We don't interpret that verse [Gen 6:6] the way you do because it has God admitting a mistake.
No you DON't interpret the verse at all! You can't because you are locked in this theology of a man-made "church" that doesn't allow you to read what it says. And it says in no uncertain terms "God regretted/was sorry/repented (take whichever version), or 'God took it to heart' (Septuagint) for having made man."
He meant "sorry" in the sense of "it's a shame that happened". It was nevertheless part of His plan. I'm sure He was "sorry" about the crucifixion too, but that was also a part of His plan.
Oh boy! This just keeps getting deeper and deeper. Now God was sorry this happened even though it was His plan to happen!?! How can you believe this? How can you not see the Reformed error that God is held captive of His own "plan?" That the "plan" is the highest authority to which even God is subject and has no control over? That's childish, naive and silly.
In dealing with rleigion on these forums, I have come to see great wisdom in Albert Einstein's take on the whole religion business: "the Bible [is] a collection of honorable but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish."
And "[T]the Jewish religion like all other religions is an incarnation of the most childish superstitions."
To which I would add mixed with some moral truths.
I am sorry, FK. We don't see eye to eye. This has been an interesting eye opener but I don't see any reason to continue this. Nothing personal.
There is plenty. For example:
Luke 2:25-32 : 25 Now there was a man in Jerusalem called Simeon, who was righteous and devout. He was waiting for the consolation of Israel, and the Holy Spirit was upon him. 26 It had been revealed to him by the Holy Spirit that he would not die before he had seen the Lord's Christ. 27 Moved by the Spirit, he went into the temple courts. When the parents brought in the child Jesus to do for him what the custom of the Law required, 28 Simeon took him in his arms and praised God, saying:
29 "Sovereign Lord, as you have promised, you now dismiss your servant in peace. 30 For my eyes have seen your salvation, 31 which you have prepared in the sight of all people, 32 a light for revelation to the Gentiles and for glory to your people Israel."
See also:
Isa 49:5-6 : 5 And now the Lord says — he who formed me in the womb to be his servant to bring Jacob back to him and gather Israel to himself, for I am honored in the eyes of the Lord and my God has been my strength — 6 he says: "It is too small a thing for you to be my servant to restore the tribes of Jacob and bring back those of Israel I have kept. I will also make you a light for the Gentiles, that you may bring my salvation to the ends of the earth."
Ps 98:3 : 3 He has remembered his love and his faithfulness to the house of Israel; all the ends of the earth have seen the salvation of our God.
Acts 9:15-16 : 15 But the Lord said to Ananias, "Go! This man is my chosen instrument to carry my name before the Gentiles and their kings and before the people of Israel. 16 I will show him how much he must suffer for my name."
There are others, but you can see that The Bible is plain on the matter.
[Re: Gen. 6:6] FK: "He meant "sorry" in the sense of "it's a shame that happened". It was nevertheless part of His plan. I'm sure He was "sorry" about the crucifixion too, but that was also a part of His plan."
Oh boy! This just keeps getting deeper and deeper. Now God was sorry this happened even though it was His plan to happen!?! How can you believe this?
I can believe it the same way I believe that the Father was "sorry" to watch His Son die on a cross, even though that was His plan too. The Bible proves that.
How can you not see the Reformed error that God is held captive of His own "plan?" That the "plan" is the highest authority to which even God is subject and has no control over? That's childish, naive and silly.
LOL! Ummmm. Let's say that I do not understand your analysis. :) The Christian God is omnipotent and all knowing. He has a plan for the world. He implements that plan within time. If God makes mistakes, then He would change His plan and adapt accordingly (my best guess at your position by your arguments). However, if God doesn't make mistakes, then there is never a need to change His plan for any reason. Therefore, God cannot be held captive by a perfect plan that He is simply executing flawlessly within time. It seems you are criticizing Reformers for not letting God be only human!!!! :)
In dealing with religion on these forums, I have come to see great wisdom in Albert Einstein's take on the whole religion business: "the Bible [is] a collection of honorable but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish."
And that is one reason our pastor says all the time that Christianity is not a religion. Instead, it is a relationship. While Einstein's brilliance cannot be overstated in some areas, he was not exactly a stellar example of spiritual wisdom. If his statement that you quoted is indicative, it does not sound like he had ears to hear or eyes to see.
I am sorry, FK. We don't see eye to eye. This has been an interesting eye opener but I don't see any reason to continue this. Nothing personal.
No offense taken. It has been very interesting for me too, and I hope to see you again in the future on perhaps some other issues. :)