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To: Forest Keeper; blue-duncan; the_conscience; wmfights; Dr. Eckleburg; stfassisi; MarkBsnr; ...
Then you must declare God's INACTION to be an ACTION. Now, SOMETIMES, a failure to act really is an act. However, to assign blame, as you do on our behalf, you must assert a duty, which you cannot

No, FK, I said "If God pre-ordained everything, then there is nothing you do or don't do without God's will acting on you." It's not blaming God. It's simply establishing whose doing all this is.

If there is no blame then there is no guilt and if there is no injustice then there is no justice either.

The idea of activity or idleness of God is also somewhat of an anthropomorphism. If God created everything and all outside of time, then what is He doing in time? If everything will happen according to His will, then why does He need to intervene? Is there a danger that His "plan" will not work, or that someone can railroad it? I don't think so.

Does it require divine intervention and guidance gven that everything has been preordained? I don't think so. One might really wonder what is God doing outside of time! After all, His work is done, isn't it? Or is it incomplete, which is to say imperfect?

5,039 posted on 04/21/2008 3:47:34 PM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodox is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50; blue-duncan; the_conscience; wmfights; Dr. Eckleburg; stfassisi; MarkBsnr; Mad Dawg; ...
If God created everything and all outside of time, then what is He doing in time?

For one thing He is carrying out the salvation of His elect. He chose to do that within time, so here He is. I suppose if men just saved themselves by their good decisions, then there wouldn't be much need for God to be here within time.

If everything will happen according to His will, then why does He need to intervene?

If you are asking whether everything is on some sort of auto-pilot or does God manage things within time, that is fair. My best guess would be that to God the question is irrelevant. But to us, I would suspect that God is active and not static. That would match better what the Bible tells us of Him. The Bible describes God as a "Doer" rather than a bystander. Therefore, it would make more sense to me that He is actively involved in our lives within time.

Is there a danger that His "plan" will not work, or that someone can railroad it? I don't think so.

That's right, and in your faith and mine, we "experience" God every day, so I can't see any problem with our thinking that God is actively THERE, everyday, watching over us and caring for us within time.

Does it require divine intervention and guidance given that everything has been preordained? I don't think so.

I don't think it's a matter of that. In our reality we think of it as the execution of something NOW that was ordained BEFORE. That takes action.

One might really wonder what is God doing outside of time! After all, His work is done, isn't it? Or is it incomplete, which is to say imperfect?

Because He is God, it is "as good as done", which can be said in no other case. However, God chose "time" as a forum in which He would execute His plan. Therefore, just like all other elect, I started out a lost sinner, God graced me, and then I had faith. All within time. It is not correct to say that if God's work is incomplete it is imperfect. God chose to work within time, but He didn't have to. We still have the second coming to look forward to, among other things. All in God's good time.

5,117 posted on 04/25/2008 2:55:12 AM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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