Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: Forest Keeper; blue-duncan; the_conscience; wmfights; Dr. Eckleburg; Mad Dawg; MarkBsnr
From the evidence of the Bible, I can't think of when Jesus commanded the Apostles to treat Him that way while He was with them (before the crucifixion).

He was never treated as God in the Synaptic Gospels; no one prayed to or worshiped him. It is only at the end of Matthew (Ch 28), just before he gives them the Great Commission that we find (verses 16-17)

Clearly here those who doubted were distinguished from those who worshiped him, and this was after the resurrection.

But even here the Greek word proskuneo does not mean worship, as in worshiping God, but rather as veneration (actually kissing of the hand type of veneration), or to do homage. This is applicable to anyone superior to you.

The Greek word for worship which means to serve, as in serving God, is latreuo.

And even when it came to venerating the Risen Christ some (it doesn't say how many) of his closest and staunchest followers were doubtful.

If they thought he is God, they would have prayed to him and worshiped him as God.

Well, I'm not certain that "doubt" absolutely equals "disbelieved".

Legalese, FK, like is isn't always' is...

But in any event, I thought it was generally accepted that solid belief as we understand it, was not fully formed until Pentecost

You are right! That's why the Synaptic Gospels (written after 70 AD) do not treat Christ as God, but concdentrate on his humanity (as a Jewish messiah), and John's Gospel (written at the end of the century, some 30 years later) does!

By then, Christianity clearly evolved into a separate religion (partly because it was rejected by the Rabbis at Jamnia) and was in fact actively doing everything to shed its Jewish roots, character, Sabbath, or mode of worship, while recognizing Jesus as fully divine as well, not just an "image of God" (as +Paul says), but God himself.

No, Jesus is described all over the OT, so the scripture IS there. Some to many did not see it. We just read this passage in church not two hours ago: Luke 24:25-27...27 And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself

Please provide passages where Moses and others, without any doubt, write about Jesus. Thank you.

4,606 posted on 03/30/2008 12:44:54 PM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4601 | View Replies ]


To: kosta50; blue-duncan; the_conscience; wmfights; Dr. Eckleburg; Mad Dawg; MarkBsnr
FK: "But in any event, I thought it was generally accepted that solid belief as we understand it, was not fully formed until Pentecost."

You are right! That's why the Synoptic Gospels (written after 70 AD) do not treat Christ as God, but concentrate on his humanity (as a Jewish messiah), and John's Gospel (written at the end of the century, some 30 years later) does!

But all of the Gospels, indeed all of the NT, was written well after Pentecost, after solid belief was fully formed. All of the writers had the correct understanding of God when they wrote God's word. They revealed incompleteness in the understanding of many, notably Mary, as it happened in history, but the theology of the NT IS correct and complete.

By then, Christianity clearly evolved into a separate religion (partly because it was rejected by the Rabbis at Jamnia) and was in fact actively doing everything to shed its Jewish roots, character, Sabbath, or mode of worship, while recognizing Jesus as fully divine as well, not just an "image of God" (as +Paul says), but God himself.

Jamnia was somewhere in the 90-100 range, and the vast majority of the NT had already been written by then. So you appear to be saying that Christianity developed "above" or "despite" what the Bible says (no doubt thanks to the hierarchy of the Church). If so, then you would be saying that what the Apostolic Church teaches does not closely match what the Bible says in many cases. On that I would agree. :)

No, Jesus is described all over the OT, so the scripture IS there. Some to many did not see it. We just read this passage in church not two hours ago: Luke 24:25-27...27 And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself.

Please provide passages where Moses and others, without any doubt, write about Jesus. Thank you.

I did that already, to you, on this thread. :) I should have saved it. What is striking to me is that you challenge the truthfulness of (a) one of the Gospels, and/or (b) Christ Himself. However, here is an excellent example of Moses writing about Jesus:

Deut 18:15-19 : 15 The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among your own brothers. You must listen to him. 16 For this is what you asked of the Lord your God at Horeb on the day of the assembly when you said, "Let us not hear the voice of the Lord our God nor see this great fire anymore, or we will die." 17 The Lord said to me: "What they say is good. 18 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers; I will put my words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him. 19 If anyone does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name, I myself will call him to account.

4,850 posted on 04/09/2008 1:22:04 AM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4606 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson