[Forest Keeper]

All we have to do is believe. The indwelling Holy Spirit will guide us to where God wants us. It is not fear of being thrown into hell that guides us. It is the love of our Father in heaven and our Saviour His Son. Works reveal the completed act and the indwelling Holy Spirit.

Yes. And it never ceases to amaze me how we are accused of being prideful. How can we be prideful when we PROCLAIM from the mountaintops that it is ALL of God? :) The position of the accusers is that man has the power and ultimately decides his own destiny by his choices. So, if man is in control, that is NOT prideful, but if GOD is in control, then we have false pride. What's that about? :)

I am confident that all of the elect on these threads could point out how they've changed over the years. How the desire to do bad things has diminished and the desire to please God has become more and more important.

I am fully confident as well. But to some, our testimonies must be thrown out in toto, because they do not rise to the level of "proof" required by some who do not believe in such phenomena. Short of a personal visit by God through a burning bush experience, I do not think that proof exists for these people in what we are talking about.

[Mad Dawg]

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[stfassisi]

“”All we have to do is believe. The indwelling Holy Spirit will guide us to where God wants us.””

Do you honestly believe that the Holy Spirit would want people to be divided into thousands of different splinter groups of protestant denominations with various beliefs opposite with each other all claiming to be guided by the Holy Spirit?

This seems to be a God of confusion.

Who do you think wants confusion?

[Alamo-Girl]

Thank you so very much for sharing your insights!

But to some, our testimonies must be thrown out in toto, because they do not rise to the level of "proof" required by some who do not believe in such phenomena. Short of a personal visit by God through a burning bush experience, I do not think that proof exists for these people in what we are talking about.

Indeed, but even God's speaking through a burning bush would not be effective to one He has not given the gift of Spiritual hearing.

IOW, it doesn't matter whether the thread is about religion, philosophy or science - when our correspondents demand physical or logical "proof" then we know the words of God are not registering in power to them - which is to say, His words are not being Spiritually heard.

Or to put it another way, the power of God is not understood by observing His miracles but rather by the hearing of the words of God.

Israel had experienced many miracles - the delivery from bondage in Egypt through mighty miracles, the parting of the Red Sea, the manna and water and so on. Even their clothes and shoes did not wear away over forty years. But they did not have the "ears to hear" - the gift of God that we have - so observing all those miracles did not avail them as we can see below and in the prophesy of the Song of Moses.

And Moses called unto all Israel, and said unto them, Ye have seen all that the LORD did before your eyes in the land of Egypt unto Pharaoh, and unto all his servants, and unto all his land; The great temptations which thine eyes have seen, the signs, and those great miracles: Yet the LORD hath not given you an heart to perceive, and eyes to see, and ears to hear, unto this day.

And I have led you forty years in the wilderness: your clothes are not waxen old upon you, and thy shoe is not waxen old upon thy foot. - Deuteronomy 29:2-5

They have moved me to jealousy with [that which is] not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities: and I will move them to jealousy with [those which are] not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation. - Deuteronomy 32:21

But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by [them that are] no people, [and] by a foolish nation I will anger you. - Romans 10:19

I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but [rather] through their fall salvation [is come] unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy. - Romans 11:11

And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous [are] thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true [are] thy ways, thou King of saints. - Revelation 15:3

If it were understood by observing miracles, the Egyptians would have believed.

Instead, the words of God are spirit and life - but only to those who have been given "ears to hear."

It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, [they] are spirit, and [they] are life. - John 6:63

My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: - John 10:27

For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater: So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper [in the thing] whereto I sent it. - Isaiah 55:10-11

Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand. And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive: For this people's heart is waxed gross, and [their] ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with [their] eyes, and hear with [their] ears, and should understand with [their] heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

But blessed [are] your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear. – Matthew 13:13-16

The power of God is Jesus Christ, the Living Word of God. When we convey the words of God and our testimony - we have done the very best we can do for anyone.

For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent. Where [is] the wise? where [is] the scribe? where [is] the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men. - I Corinthians 1:18-25

Therefore I aver that when our correspondents insist on "proof" we ought to pray in order to know whether to continue for the sake of the Lurkers or whether to go to more fertile ground.

Of these things put [them] in remembrance, charging [them] before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, [but] to the subverting of the hearers.

Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

But shun profane [and] vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus; Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.

Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. - 2 Timothy 2:14-19

After all, if our correspondents do not believe the words of God - we cannot expect them to believe our testimony.

To God be the glory!

[kosta50]

And it never ceases to amaze me how we are accused of being prideful. How can we be prideful when we PROCLAIM from the mountaintops that it is ALL of God?

By presuming to be the mouthpieces of God.

So, if man is in control, that is NOT prideful

Being free is not a presumption of pride. We are not robots.

I am fully confident as well [that all of the elect on these threads could point out how they've changed over the years. How the desire to do bad things has diminished–wmfights].

A change in human desire can happen for many reasons. Wew don't necessarily know why we change in the course of a lifetime.

But to some, our testimonies must be thrown out in toto, because they do not rise to the level of "proof" required by some who do not believe in such phenomena.

Yes, it burns you doesn't it, because if you had proof you would be the first to post it! So, you dismiss it. Conveniently. It's funny how we demand proof for everything else in life except what we believe. Amazing.

And it is not that "some of us" do not believe in such a phenomenon (i.e. that we can become kinder, gentler creatures, and whish to do unto others as we would others do unto us), but that some of us are honest enough to say "I really don't know why this change took place but if it is from God, I thank Him from the bottom of my heart."

Short of a personal visit by God through a burning bush experience, I do not think that proof exists for these people in what we are talking about.

If you have no proof, then it is an assumption. If you believe an assumption, then it is a belief and not a fact.  You are free to believe whatever you want. My only objection is when people present what they believe in (for whatever reason) as a matter of fact. That goes for Calvinsits as well as the Orthodox, Catholics, Muslims, Jews, Shinto, Hindus, etc.