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To: wmfights; Uncle Chip; P-Marlowe; HarleyD; Forest Keeper; Gamecock; Alex Murphy; the_conscience; ...
Thanks UC, I hadn't really put that together before. The natural progression then proceeded from State mandated religion to freedom of religion and separation of church and state.

The Biblical truth behind capitalism resides in the acknowledgment that God gives men their place on earth, numbers their days, establishes their boundaries, and that each man is thus required to glorify God in thought, word and deed in this life.

If the reason for our very existence is to glorify God on earth, then it follows that our work is the fruit of the spirit, and thus that work is good and God-given.

Before the Reformation, men were told their lives on earth were simply preface to their heavenly existence, and so it didn't matter that despots ruled over them. This myopia is what accounts for the lethargy found in places even today like Catholic Central and South America, etc.

But as the Bible was actually read by the masses during the Reformation, men understood that God had ordained them to be fruitful now, and thus they had a right and responsibility on this earth today, according to God's will for them, which included a liberty of life and conscience.

I really like Loraine (a guy) Boettner's book, "The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination," especially the last chapter...

CALVINISM IN HISTORY

As Uncle Chip pointed out, the correct understanding of separation between church and state (while always maintaining the state's responsibility to protect the rights of the church) was a gradual process coming to fruition in the reformed churches...

"At the time of the Reformation the Lutheran Church did not make such a complete break with the Catholic Church as did the Reformed. In fact some Lutherans point out with pride that Lutheranism was a "moderate Reformation." While all protestants appealed to the Bible as a final authority, the tendency in Lutheranism was to keep as much of the old system as did not have to be thrown out, while the tendency in the Reformed Church was to throw out all that did not have to be kept.

And in regard to the relationship which existed between the Church and the State, the Lutherans were content to allow the local princes great influence in the Church or even to allow them to determine the religion within their bounds — a tendency leading toward the establishment of a State Church — while the Reformed soon came to demand complete separation between Church and State."

Even those who worked against the Reformation knew the inherent power and truth of its goal -- individual freedom according to the words and will of God...

"The testimony of Emilio Castelar, the famous Spanish statesman, orator and scholar, is interesting and valuable. Castelar had been professor of Philosophy in the University of Madrid before he entered politics, and he was made president of the republic which was set up by the Liberals in 1873. As a Roman Catholic he hated Calvin and Calvinism. Says he: "It was necessary for the republican movement that there should come a morality more austere than Luther's, the morality of Calvin, and a Church more democratic than the German, the Church of Geneva. The Anglo-Saxon democracy has for its lineage a book of a primitive society — the Bible. It is the product of a severe theology learned by the few Christian fugitives in the gloomy cities of Holland and Switzerland, where the morose shade of Calvin still wanders . . . And it remains serenely in its grandeur, forming the most dignified, most moral and most enlightened portion of the human race."

The Reformation underscored the validity of the "trickle-down theory of economics." As Christ told us, "For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required" (Luke 12:48). All philanthropy is founded on sharing the bounty of God's world by producing more of it through the God-given mandate to help our fellow man become likewise productive. Thus the truest basis for a sound and God-glorifying capitalism is to abide by Paul's instructions...

"And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him." -- Colossians 3:17

1,840 posted on 02/10/2008 10:55:29 AM PST by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg; wmfights; Uncle Chip; P-Marlowe; HarleyD; Forest Keeper; Gamecock; Alex Murphy; ...
Thank you so very much for all of your insights and for those engaging excerpts and the beautiful Scripture!

The posters might also find this resource helpful:

American Colonist's Library - a treasury of Primary Documents

The influence of the Reformation is very apparent in many of the founder's sources.

As to the mind of early America, the New England Primary is quite telling. The Calvinist influence is obvious. From the forward:

If such proposed practices violate the Constitution, it is fair to ask just what sort of education the writers of the Constitution had in mind when they wrote the First Amendment. It does not necessarily follow, of course, that the intentions of these men were perfect and must bind the nation for ever. But there are procedures for changing the Constitution, so unless and until the relevant sections are changed, the intent of the original writers is still the supreme law of the United States.

So what was the intent of the writers for a suitably secular, First-Amendment-conforming, public education?

One way to answer this question is to look at the textbooks actually used in schools in the early days of our nation. In this sense, the New England Primer provides an excellent "case study".

The New England Primer (pronounced prim' er, short "i") was by far the most commonly used textbook in the United States for over 100 years. The first edition was printed in 1690 and it was still in use in 1900. It was used in both public and private schools. It was intended to be used to help teach children to read: it includes a rhyme to teach the alphabet, vocabulary words, and many short poems and other practice reading selections. While the idea of having separate grade levels was not introduced until the 1800's, this book was used for what would today be considered first grade. It also includes some religious references.

Most if not all of the writers of the Constitution would have used this book in school. They were all surely aware of it. It continued to be used, with no apparent challenge, long after the Constitution was ratified. If it violated what they had in mind when they wrote the First Amendment, surely someone would have said something about it. So it is fair to say that the people who wrote the First Amendment must have considered the treatment of religion in this book acceptable. I therefore offer it here as an example of a book which fully conforms with our Constitution. I urge you to scan through it and see if you can find the religious references.


1,841 posted on 02/10/2008 11:15:57 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Dr. Eckleburg

Thanks for the ping.


1,844 posted on 02/10/2008 12:26:31 PM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg; kosta50; wmfights; Uncle Chip; P-Marlowe; HarleyD; Forest Keeper; Gamecock; ...
“The Biblical truth behind capitalism resides in the acknowledgment that God gives men their place on earth, numbers their days, establishes their boundaries, and that each man is thus required to glorify God in thought, word and deed in this life.”

The biblical truth behind capitalism is stewardship. He has a purpose for all and has given talents to all to accomplish that purpose and commanded we multiply those talents, whether its children for propagation or giftedness like Bezaleel and Aholiab. He has given certain guidelines like:

Lev. 19:36, “Just balances, just weights, a just ephah, and a just hin, shall ye have: I am the LORD your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt.”

James 4:13-15, “Go to now, ye that say, To day or to morrow we will go into such a city, and continue there a year, and buy and sell, and get gain: Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away. For that ye ought to say, If the Lord will, we shall live, and do this, or that.”

He has given guidelines for servant-master relationships.

He has admonished to lay up capital for the future:

Prov. 6:6-8, “Go to the ant, thou sluggard; consider her ways, and be wise: Which having no guide, overseer, or ruler, Provideth her meat in the summer, and gathereth her food in the harvest.”

Eph. 4:28, “Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.”

1 Thess. 4:11-12, “And that ye study to be quiet, and to do your own business, and to work with your own hands, as we commanded you; That ye may walk honestly toward them that are without, and that ye may have lack of nothing.”

2 Cor. 12:14, “Behold, the third time I am ready to come to you; and I will not be burdensome to you: for I seek not yours, but you: for the children ought not to lay up for the parents, but the parents for the children.”

They bought and sold property as did Abraham, Jeremiah and Barabas. They were merchants with property as were Peter, Andrew, James, John and Lydia and Philemon.

It was not the systems of capitalism or socialism/communism (the early church) that were the problem, but the selfishness of man’s fallen nature either in unbridled ambition, greed, self indulgence, presumption or laziness.

1,845 posted on 02/10/2008 2:04:08 PM PST by blue-duncan
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