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To: wmfights; topcat54; Lee N. Field; 1000 silverlings; Alex Murphy; Lord_Calvinus; tabsternager; ...
I don't believe God is done with the Jews either

Where does Scripture say God is not done with the Jews as a group instead of as individuals the same as you and me?

Where does Scripture say that the Gospel is not now being preached to every Jew exactly as it is being preached to you and me?

Where does Scripture say it is not incumbent upon every Jew today to fall to their knees in praise of Jesus Christ exactly as it is incumbent upon you and me?

Dispensationalists love to say they do not allegorize the Bible. And yet they seem to ignore the core truth of the Scriptures -- all men are called today to worship Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. Nothing is postponed. Nothing is delayed. Christ came, was resurrected and now all the world is commanded to recognize that fact today since no one knows the hour when this life will be over and we will be held accountable for our testimony.

"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus." -- Gal. 3:28

I honestly have no idea how a dispensationalist can read Hebrews and still hold to their "postponed" scenario...

"But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away." -- Hebrews 8:6-13

National Israel means as much to God as national Guam or national Thailand. What matters since Calvary is whether or not a man's heart is circumcised by God.

Paul speaks not of national Israel but of individual Jews, some of whom will come to Christ and others who won't. There's nothing political in his explanation, regardless of how the world's politics play out.

"Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

(According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear;) unto this day.

And David saith, Let their table be made a snare, and a trap, and a stumblingblock, and a recompence unto them:

Let their eyes be darkened, that they may not see, and bow down their back alway.

I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.

Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?

For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them.

For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?" -- Romans 11:6-15

Paul is clearly and simply saying heaven rejoices when any man is graced with faith. Certainly with the gentile, but even more with the Jew who didn't just not recognize Christ as Savior, but actually denied He was the Savior.

Each believing Jew is like the lost sheep whom the Father rejoices He has returned to the fold.

"Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.

And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent" -- Matthew 27:50-51

Not partially torn, but severed from the top to the bottom. "Believe and be saved." Now.

The Gospel is diminished by the preaching of dispensationalism.

LORDSHIP, NON-LORDSHIP AND DISPENSATIONALISM

"...Let me say at the outset that this dispensational system of theology is diametrically opposed to covenant theology. It opposes all historic Reformed Theology, such as that which is taught in the Westminster Confession, the Old Baptist Confession of 1689, and the Heidelberg Catechism. Dispensationalism would have been declared heresy by the Synod of Dort as was her husband, Arminianism. Arminianism, Dispensationalism and Antinomianism all live in the same theological house (and it is not a Reformed house!).

I say, without fear of contradiction, Dispensationalism is nothing less than a frontal attack on Covenant and Reformed Theology..."


1,724 posted on 11/23/2007 10:55:50 AM PST by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg; wmfights
Where does Scripture say God is not done with the Jews as a group instead of as individuals the same as you and me? Where does Scripture say that the Gospel is not now being preached to every Jew exactly as it is being preached to you and me? Where does Scripture say it is not incumbent upon every Jew today to fall to their knees in praise of Jesus Christ exactly as it is incumbent upon you and me?

You misunderstand. It is most definitely encumbent upon every Jew and Gentile to receive the Gospel of the new covenant during this church age. No dispensationalist is or should be arguing otherwise. But this church age of the new covenant will come to an end one day soon, and as it comes to its end, then this is what God says will happen to a remnant of Jews:

"For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days [of the new covenant that we are in right now], saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people. And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more." [Hebrews 8:10-12]

This clearly is not the New Testament Church in which every the pastor is called a teacher and virtually every ministry is a teaching ministry. This will be a sovereign work of salvation by God on behalf of the remnant of the House of Israel.

Surely a Calvinist should have no objection to God doing this for whomsoever He chooses. Surely after those days He can have mercy on whomsoever He chooses to have mercy.

1,726 posted on 11/23/2007 1:04:21 PM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
I say, without fear of contradiction, Dispensationalism is nothing less than a frontal attack on Covenant and Reformed Theology..."

Then "Covenant and Reformed Theology" is built on shifting sands and will fall --

1,727 posted on 11/23/2007 1:08:24 PM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
Where does Scripture say God is not done with the Jews as a group instead of as individuals the same as you and me?

Check your bible...Could be someone acccidentally ripped out the 2nd half of Romans 11...

Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.

Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Zion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
Rom 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

Rom 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

Rom 11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

1,731 posted on 11/23/2007 4:23:21 PM PST by Iscool
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