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To: Mad Dawg; Dr. Eckleburg; Grudgebringer; xzins; HarleyD; wmfights
Thank you for your reply and for sharing your insights!

As for “to God be glory, not man”: if that is meant as a criticism of the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception or of this claim about J the B, I’m astonished. You know, or should know, that we think these things are entirely by God’s power and grace, and not man’s doing at all. It’s not, in the first consideration, that Mary and J the B are such swell people. It’s that God is a remarkably and always surprisingly swell (to use the theological term) God, and they are recipients of remarkably swell gifts. That Mary and J the B are swell afterwards is God’s doing.

As you probably already know, I personally eschew all the doctrines and traditions of men across the board - so doctrines such as the Immaculate Conception of Mary and sinlessness in John the Baptist have no currency with me.

If you are led of the Spirit to embrace such doctrines and traditions, then that is what you must do.

I am led by God the Father's revelations in 1) Jesus Christ His only begotten Son, 2) the indwelling Holy Spirit, 3) the Scriptures which the Spirit has personally authenticated and 4) the Creation both spiritual and physical.

And I too will do as the Spirit leads me. (Romans 8, John 15-17 et al)

On the other point, my declaration "To God be the glory, not man." - agrees with the Great Commandment.

The second commandment is not the Great Commandment.

Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment.

And the second [is] like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. – Matt 22:37-40

If we keep these two commandments, the rest is just details - hence the importance of keeping the priorities.

There is only one Great Commandment.

The same message of priorities appears throughout Scripture, though I am particularly fond of Revelation chapters four and five.

So again I say:

To God be the glory, not man.


955 posted on 10/29/2007 9:53:41 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Alamo-Girl
If we keep these two commandments, the rest is just details - hence the importance of keeping the priorities. There is only one Great Commandment.

Amen, Alamo-Girl! Only one.

"And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:

And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.

And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes.

And thou shalt write them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates...

Ye shall not go after other gods, of the gods of the people which are round about you;

(For the LORD thy God is a jealous God among you) lest the anger of the LORD thy God be kindled against thee, and destroy thee from off the face of the earth.

Ye shall not tempt the LORD your God" -- Deuteronomy 6:5-9;14-16


"But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?

And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!

For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother." -- Matthew 12:48-50


956 posted on 10/29/2007 11:32:31 PM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Alamo-Girl
I agree, in large part.

I disagree, as you know, that the Immaculate conception is one of the "doctrines and traditions of men". My comment was conditional, thus: "If that is meant as a criticism ..." (with the accent on the 'if'.)

My subsidiary point was that doctrine, as articulated, obeys the injunction to give God the glory, and proclaims, as we understand it, one of the examples of His gloriousness.

I enthusiastically pray the Non nobis(Ps 115).

959 posted on 10/30/2007 5:10:15 AM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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