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To: Elsie

Yes, I would certainly test them. Very good point.

The point I was leading up to is this: If you were visited (verification assumed) by God the Father and Jesus Christ, would it not be THE defining moment of your life? Of course it would. So, my problem is, why would Joseph Smith not be able to RECALL THE EXACT DATE this occurred? Nowhere in any pro or con Mormon writings/history is there a single mention of a date, other than “oh, sometime in the Spring of 1820”.

As Gordon B. Hinckley has recently said (paraphrasing): “If the first vision story is not true, then our church is a sham.”

If this date is the pivotal point in world history of restoring the Gospel to all mankind, wouldn’t it make sense that Joseph Smith would have this date burned in his memory, rather than only being able to give us a roundabout 2-3 month maybe period?


184 posted on 09/27/2007 11:16:58 AM PDT by nesnah
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To: nesnah
That is a tenuous argument at best. I recall where I was on Nov 23, 1963 and all the events of that day. Same with 911. Same with the day I was saved, and the day I was baptized. Same with the day I was married, and the days when my parents died.

Does anyone here claim to know the exact moment when the HS entered into him or her? I doubt it, since a tree takes a long time to bear fruit and only by the fruits of their lives shall the work of the HS be apparent in them.

The change is gradual, from calling, to justifying, to sanctifying to glorifying. The new man is built from the inside out and is not overnight and all at once.

194 posted on 09/27/2007 2:24:40 PM PDT by 1000 silverlings
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