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To: ClancyJ

***I have heard several COC preachers say that in their youth they use to feel that if they did not get in one last prayer for forgiveness, they were goners.***

I know several that still feel that way, including a C of C preacher. There is absolutly NO assurance in their CofC or my English version of restorationists.
My mom on her death bed actually cried out in fear because she “haden’t done enough” to earn her salvation. Her preachers then told her she had done enough. Wait a minute! I thought, Who gave them the authority to decide if a person has done enough or not.

I have been out of “that” group since 1973, and had the shackles of legalism broken by talking to a “Grace” believer.


75 posted on 08/18/2007 1:31:06 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Ever see WILLIS SHAW backwards in your rear view mirror? I have!)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar

Interesting point. Certain CoC branches pride themselves in having preachers that are unschooled in theology. I have met several.

I suspect that unless the Holy Spirit was trumpeting loudly in their ears, that their theological error is larger and more rapid than is otherwise possible.


78 posted on 08/18/2007 1:43:23 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (V. Angelus Domini nuntiavit Mariae. R. Et concepit de Spiritu Sancto.)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
See, her views came from the last generation’s emphasis on works and following the technicalities of the
Bible.

She may not have meant “earn her salvation” but have only really meant being true to God’s plans for her.

Jesus paid for our sins by His death which was why He was sent.
When we acknowledge that Jesus is the Son of God, repent of our sins and are baptized for the remission of those sins, we are buried with Christ in baptism and arise to a new life. We are given the gift of the Holy Spirit living in our hearts.

From then on we follow Jesus to the best of our ability. Now we can turn our backs on Jesus, fall away or deny Him, and lose our salvation. But, we also can ask for forgiveness and go forward.

The authority they had as preachers was that they knew she accepted Christ as her Savior, was baptized and attempted to follow Him. The bible teaching was the authority.

Many wonderful people who have served God all their lives feel that way on their deathbed. It shows an acknowledgment that each of us could do more and regret that we did not.

I too would get irritated at preachers telling us you are saved by grace of Jesus’ death. Then before the end of the sermon, they would say, but be back here next week or ........... I would go out the door thinking “they giveth and they taketh away”.

But I feel that is the fault of the preacher.

God will judge each one of us on Judgment Day. And, I trust that the whole of each man will be looked at with eyes that see the whole of us with all our imperfections in character, genealogy, mistakes and failings and look into our hearts.

It is interesting that you question the authority to decide if a person has done enough or not, yet you believe in a church with a pope, bishops, priests on and on.

151 posted on 08/20/2007 9:50:35 AM PDT by ClancyJ
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