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To: the_conscience
I like the phrase "active and passive obedience" -- all the more as I consider that at the root of "obedience" is "to listen intently".

In the interests of not just taking every dialectical fist to the chops and of saying that the question of works righteousness is not, IMHO, as either-or as some seem to think it is, I'd like to quote from a reading in the "Office of Readings" for today -- which is a big day for us Calflicks:

I repeat, it is owing to his favor that salvation is yours through faith. This is not your own doing, it is God's gift; neither is it a reward for anything you have accomplished, so let no one pride himself on it. We are truly his handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to lead the life of good deeds which God prepared for us in advance.
Ephesians 2:8-10
Grace -- the gift that keeps on giving! Shaken down, pressed together, running over.
13 posted on 08/15/2007 4:39:14 AM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: Mad Dawg

“I like the phrase “active and passive obedience” — all the more as I consider that at the root of “obedience” is “to listen intently”.”

Dawg,
I’m happy you like the phrase yet I get the impression that we have different conceptions as to the significance of the phrase especially as it relates to Christ’s active obedience. No doubt we agree, along with most of Christendom, that Christ’s passive obedience was the propitiation for our disobedience.

If Christ’s passive obedience carried such a great cosmic significance would it not follow that his active obedience carries a similar cosmic significance? Surely his active obedience provides the supreme moral example and as such reveals the nature of God but what, if any, cosmic significance was effectuated by Christ fulfilling the law?

That answer can be found in the meta-narrative of Scripture. Paul’s reference to Christ as the 2nd Adam pulls us back to the garden narrative and helps us see what cosmic significance the 1st Adams probationary testing and subsequent failure resulted in. If the kin of the 1st Adam were accredited for the actions of the head of the family and become enemies with the Father would it not follow that the kin of the 2nd Adam, in like manner, be accredited for the actions of the head of the family? Yes, I believe that follows and is an essential element in the meta-narrative of Scripture. So Christ’s obedience not only satisfies the wrath of the Father because of our kinship with the 1st Adam , but is also accredited to his kin and we become friends with the Father because of the actions of the head of the family.

So then, let’s reexamine Rusty’s case. Since faith is what brings us into kinship with the 2nd Adam the question naturally arises as to how we can one be assured that ones faith truly puts us in the family. But let’s back up and consider how one can be assured that they are in the 1st Adam’s family. In Rusty’s case, as with most works-righteousness Christians, he would introspectively and internally examine his experiences as the basis for belief and furthermore make sure that those experiences are an adequate basis for his belief. So Rusty might examine his experiences as a human and examine the experiences of Adam and be assured that he is in fact a kin of Adam. For Rusty to be assured of faith he cannot simply receive and rest upon Christ but must be aware of what experiences result from faith and furthermore those experiences are adequate for a true faith. As we can see from the above, Rusty seems to be striving to find the experience that is adequate to justify his belief and give him assurance.

Let me propose, because the nature of faith is transcendent, that an externalist view of faith provides greater assurance. In this case the externalist would only need to understand the concepts of faith and that there are no factors that would undermine those concepts. For the externalist one understands the concepts of the Gospel through the call of the Spirit and election in Christ and as such receives and rests upon Christ. As long as their faith is of this type they can be assured it is a true faith not relying upon experience for assurance but rather experience bolsters faith as long as it does not undermine the concepts.


16 posted on 08/15/2007 11:51:17 PM PDT by the_conscience
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