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To: NYer
"The Catholic [C]hurch is not the only church"

If this is true, then is not the speaker a heretic? And if this man is a heretic, then did he also not cease to be a bishop? Are the faithful bound to obey, support and follow a "bishop" who is a public heretic? I wouldn't have thought so.

19 posted on 08/04/2007 9:01:56 PM PDT by cothrige
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To: cothrige
That’s the sticking point. A heretic loses jurisdiction in the matter in which he departs from the Church but remains the legal occupant of the office. An apostate is no longer Catholic and can be ignored altogether. Anything he rules is meaningless.

I’m trying to figure out if Mahony is simply a heretic or an all out apostate. The above statement leans towards the latter.

21 posted on 08/04/2007 9:37:39 PM PDT by Canticle_of_Deborah (Catholic4Mitt)
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To: cothrige; TheSpottedOwl; 353FMG; Patriotic1; jobim; tioga; ducdriver; bboop; Straight Vermonter; ...
Mahony: "The Catholic [C]hurch is not the only church"

If this is true, then is not the speaker a heretic? And if this man is a heretic, then did he also not cease to be a bishop? Are the faithful bound to obey, support and follow a "bishop" who is a public heretic? I wouldn't have thought so.

Because of the extreme danger an individual such as this presents to the Faith and to the Church - and to the good of countless souls - the laity are required to hold as anathema and to absolutely seperate themselves from any formal heretic, i.e one who is public, knowing, and obstinant in his heresy.

A formal heretic such as Mahony loses ALL authority and jurisdcion, in all matters, and ireedemably so, by his own act of heresy, without any need for judgement by the Church. All that remains is to throw the bum out on the street - or to persuade the State of California to take him in. Interestingly enough Section 7 of "Cum Ex Apostolatus Officio", which I cite below, permits the laity to request the state to remove a heretical squatter from the premises. Fat chance on enlisting Arnold for that!

St. Thomas Aquinas on loss of jurisdiction by heretics:

Summa, 2a 2ae, q. 39, art. 3. (Utrum schismatici habeant aliquam potestatem)

"...Potestas autem iurisdictionis est quae ex simplici iniunctione hominis confertur; et talis potestas non immobiliter adhaeret; unde in schismaticis et haereticis non manet; unde non possunt nec absolvere, nec excommunicare, nec indulgentias facere, aut aliquid huiusmodi; quod si fecerint, nihil est actum."

 (Whether schismatics have any power.)

"...The power of jurisdiction, however [as opposed to the power of Orders, which he has just discussed], is that [power] which is conferred simply by the injunction of man; and this power does not adhere immovably; therefore it does not remain in schismatics and heretics. Hence they can neither absolve, nor excommunicate, nor grant indulgences, or anything of this sort. If they do this, the act is null."
 

Code of Canon Law (1917), Canon 188.4:

Canon 188:  "Ob tacitam renuntiationem ab ipso iure admissam quaelibet officia vacant ipso facto et sine
ulla declaratione, si clerus ...     (4) a fide catholica publice defecerit."

Canon 188:  "There are certain causes which effect the tacit resignation of an office, which resignation is accepted in advance by operation of law, and hence is effective without any declaration.  These causes are:
(4) if he has publicly fallen away from the Catholic faith."

CUM EX APOSTOLATUS OFFICIO
APOSTOLIC CONSTITUTION OF HIS HOLINESS POPE PAUL IV, 15TH FEBUARY 1559
(ROMAN BULLARIUM VOL. IV. SEC. I, PP. 354-357)

6. In addition, [by this Our Constitution, which is to remain valid in perpetuity We enact, determine, decree and define:-]

that if ever at any time it shall appear that any Bishop, even if he be acting as an Archbishop, Patriarch or Primate; or any Cardinal of the aforesaid Roman Church, or, as has already been mentioned, any legate, or even the Roman Pontiff, prior to his promotion or his elevation as Cardinal or Roman Pontiff, has deviated from the Catholic Faith or fallen into some heresy:

(i) the promotion or elevation, even if it shall have been uncontested and by the unanimous assent of all the Cardinals, shall be null, void and worthless;

(ii) it shall not be possible for it to acquire validity (nor for it to be said that it has thus acquired validity) through the acceptance of the office, of consecration, of subsequent authority, nor through possession of administration, nor through the putative enthronement of a Roman Pontiff, or Veneration, or obedience accorded to such by all, nor through the lapse of any period of time in the foregoing situation;

(iii) it shall not be held as partially legitimate in any way;....

7. Finally, [by this Our Constitution, which is to remain valid in perpetuity, We] also [enact, determine, define and decree]:-

that subject persons, be they members of anysoever of the following categories:

(i) the clergy, secular and religious;

(ii) the laity;....

shall be permitted at any time to withdraw with impunity from obedience and devotion to those thus promoted or elevated and to avoid them as warlocks, heathens, publicans, and heresiarchs (the same subject persons, nevertheless, remaining bound by the duty of fidelity and obedience to any future Bishops, Archbishops, Patriarchs, Primates, Cardinals and Roman Pontiff canonically entering).

To the greater confusion, moreover, of those thus promoted or elevated, if these shall have wished to prolong their government and authority, they shall be permitted to request the assistance of the secular arm against these same individuals thus promoted or elevated; nor shall those who withdraw on this account, in the aforementioned circumstances, from fidelity and obedience to those thus promoted and elevated, be subject, as are those who tear the tunic of the Lord, to the retribution of any censures or penalties.

8. [The provisions of this Our Constitution, which is to remain valid in perpetuity are to take effect] notwithstanding any Constitutions, Apostolic Ordinations, privileges, indults or Apostolic Letters,....

29 posted on 08/05/2007 11:32:25 AM PDT by Youngstown (Venerable Anne Katherine Emmerich: "PRAY FOR THE CHURCH OF DARKNESS TO LEAVE ROME!")
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