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To: kosta50; D-fendr; blue-duncan; Forest Keeper; xzins; P-Marlowe; irishtenor; MarkBsnr; HarleyD; ...
Here's your mistake. God is immutable...

"...the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth" -- James 1:17-18

And God loves His children immutably, perfectly, personally and forever, having begat them from before the foundation of the world...

"According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved." -- Ephesians 1:4-6

This love sometimes takes the form of encouragement and plenitude, but it can also take the form of chastisement and refining, all in order to teach and guide His children as He leads them home.

"For I the LORD love judgment, I hate robbery for burnt offering; and I will direct their work in truth, and I will make an everlasting covenant with them." -- Isaiah 61:8

Likewise, God's wrath is immutable regarding the chaff. He does not love the condemned.

"Surely thou wilt slay the wicked, O God: depart from me therefore, ye bloody men.

For they speak against thee wickedly, and thine enemies take thy name in vain.

Do not I hate them, O LORD, that hate thee? and am not I grieved with those that rise up against thee?

I hate them with perfect hatred: I count them mine enemies." -- Psalm 139:19-22

To some it is given to know the truth and to some this understanding is withheld, according to the immutable will of God.

"He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.

Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand." -- Matthew 13:11-13

Christ further illustrates the two divisions of men with the parable of the wheat and the tares...

"Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field.

He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;

The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;

The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.

As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world." -- Matthew 13:36-40

All men are sinners. Some men are acquitted of their sins by Christ on the cross, and some men remain condemned by them, all according to the "mystery of His will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself" (Ephesians 1:9)

6,072 posted on 09/12/2007 11:06:08 AM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg

Thanks for your post.

How then do you read this from the Westninster Confession of Faith:

“There is but one only living and true God, who is infinite in being and perfection, a most pure spirit, invisible, without body, parts, or passions..”

A different definition of passions?


6,104 posted on 09/12/2007 4:42:37 PM PDT by D-fendr
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To: Dr. Eckleburg; D-fendr; blue-duncan; Forest Keeper; xzins; P-Marlowe; MarkBsnr; HarleyD
Here's your mistake. God is immutable...

That's not my mistake; I never said God changes; to the contrary! That which is perfect (i.e. complete) does not change.

Likewise, God's wrath is immutable regarding the chaff. He does not love the condemned

God gives equally to the righteous and the unrighteous. He is impartial. He loves the saved and the condemned equally. It is our spiritual state (of accepting or rejecting God) that is experienced either as His love or His wrath.

Those who love God experience it as blessings and those who hate Him as burning fire. Love is fire; some are warmed by it, others are burned; but the fire remains the same.

All men are sinners. Some men are acquitted of their sins by Christ on the cross, and some men remain condemned by them

That doesn't fit your double predestination theology, Dr. E, according to which mankind was either "acquitted" or "condemned" before mankind existed! And not only that, but since salvation or damnation is not work-based, or has anything to do with our free will, acquittal and condemnation become oxymorons.

6,112 posted on 09/12/2007 8:04:07 PM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
Thank you so very much for your beautiful essay-post and those glorious Scriptures!
6,118 posted on 09/12/2007 9:50:26 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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