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To: DouglasKC
Deu 23:3 An Ammonite or Moabite shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to their tenth generation shall they not enter into the congregation of the LORD forever: Deu 23:4 Because they met you not with bread and with water in the way, when ye came forth out of Egypt; and because they hired against thee Balaam the son of Beor of Pethor of Mesopotamia, to curse thee.

[ See, your reading ability is poor. That passage refer to the forbidding of the entrance of the Moabites into the Congregation of the Lord, not the marriage of them.]

Many scholars believe that indeed you became a member of congregation of the Lord by marrying an Israelite and this is what is being referred to.

Is that what the passage says?

It doesn't say a word about marriage!

And many scholars also say that the passage refers only to men!

You will note that vs.1-2 refer to someone having their stones and privy members cut off' and a 'bastard' Clearly, all references to men.

[ Now, since the word Moabite is used, it is clear that it was the men who were the ones forbidden to enter into the Congregation, not the women. ]

The word "Moabite" is an English translation of a word that is translated "Moab" once, "Moabite" 6 times, "Moabites" 3 times and, Moabitess 6 times. It does not designate a sex in and of itself.

Ofcourse it does!

Based on the context as noted above in vs.1-2!.

And many scholars think exactly that, that it only referred to the men.

Your supposition that it refers only to men is due to two things: 1. You only believe that one, particular, English translation of scripture is valid and you don't recognize hebrew, chaldee or any other language as valid. 2. You believe that Ruth was a racial Moabite.

1. Yes, I believe there is only one valid English translation, the King James, but that doesn't change anything since every translation translated the word 'Moabite'

2. Nothing in any of those foreign languages changes the fact that the context is referring to men.

3. You only reject the truth of that fact, because you don't want to believe that Ruth was, in fact, what the Bible says she was, a woman from the people of Moab.

God didn't forbid Egyptians. Just the opposite: Deu 23:7 Thou shalt not abhor an Edomite; for he is thy brother: thou shalt not abhor an Egyptian; because thou wast a stranger in his land.

[ First, that is not dealing with marriage, now is it? It is dealing with hospitality. ]

Oh? Deu 23:7 Thou shalt not abhor an Edomite; for he is thy brother: thou shalt not abhor an Egyptian; because thou wast a stranger in his land. Deu 23:8 The children that are begotten of them shall enter into the congregation of the LORD in their third generation. That's pretty hospitable of them to have sex, have children, but not get married.

Where does it say anything about Israelites marrying with Egytians and Edomites? It just means that Egyptian and Edomite children are allowed the same rights of the Israelites in the 3rd generation.

It doesn't say a word about intermarriage!

All of you B.I. guys must have the same inability to read what is actually there, and read into it, something that isn't.

[ Actually, you yourself admitted to my comment regarding foreign women and their false gods' maybe so, amd it so to anyone who can read either English or Hebrew. ]

Maybe so applies to SOME foreign women. But has been painstakingly pointed out in scripture, by the mouth of the Lord himself, this wasn't the stated reason with Moabites.

It applies to all of those women listed in Ezra 9:1, which included the Moabite women.

The forbidding of foreign women was based on their clinging to their false Gods.

Ruth gave up hers, so she could marry Boaz and did.

So, there was nothing 'painsakingly pointed out by the Lord' forbidding marriage to a Moabitess, when she had converted to the Israelite faith.

That view only comes from your own flawed interpretation of scripture which is due to poor reading skills and a dishonest heart.

No matter how much you try and wiggle around it, it's still there: Deu 23:3 An Ammonite or Moabite shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to their tenth generation shall they not enter into the congregation of the LORD forever: Deu 23:4 Because they met you not with bread and with water in the way, when ye came forth out of Egypt; and because they hired against thee Balaam the son of Beor of Pethor of Mesopotamia, to curse thee. God stated his reason. Don't substitute your own.

And once again that passage doesn't refer to the Moabite women.

And you have not addressed the passage in Ezra 9:1 where Egyptian women are mentioned as well as Moabite ones.

1 Now when these things were done, the princes came to me, saying, The people of Israel, and the priests, and the Levites, have not separated themselves from the people of the lands, doing according to their abominations, even of the Canaanites, the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Jebusites, the Ammonites, the Moabites, the Egyptians, and the Amorites.

So, the basis of rejection of those women as wives was their idol worship.

Yet, Joseph married an Egyptian woman.

So, it is you are rejecting the word of God by placing your own spin on the Book of Ruth.

Boaz could marry a Moabitess because she had rejected her own pagan gods and accepted the true God of Israel.

Your appeal to Deut.23:3-4 doesn't change that fact, since it doesn't refer to women, as the context proves from verses 1-2.

So, once again, the attempts by the B.I. sect, to twist the clear words of God, fail.

735 posted on 09/10/2007 3:40:34 AM PDT by fortheDeclaration (We must beat the Democrats or the country will be ruined! - Lincoln)
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To: fortheDeclaration; Diego1618
Is that what the passage says? It doesn't say a word about marriage! And many scholars also say that the passage refers only to men!

I guess we have to depend on other evidence to support our views then.

Where does it say anything about Israeliteos marrying with Egytians and Edomites? It just means that Egyptian and Edomite children are allowed the same rights of the Israelites in the 3rd generation. It doesn't say a word about intermarriage! All of you B.I. guys must have the same inability to read what is actually there, and read into it, something that isn't.

That's just ridiculous. You honestly believe that God is referring to spawning generations of children without marriage??

Deu 23:2 "No one of illegitimate birth shall enter the assembly of the LORD; none of his descendants, even to the tenth generation, shall enter the assembly of the LORD.

Yet, Joseph married an Egyptian woman. So, it is you are rejecting the word of God by placing your own spin on the Book of Ruth. Boaz could marry a Moabitess because she had rejected her own pagan gods and accepted the true God of Israel.

First of all, the ONLY reason given in the Torah for not being able to marry a Moabite (which is like saying "American") has been pointed out numerous times:

Deu 23:3 "No Ammonite or Moabite shall enter the assembly of the LORD; none of their descendants, even to the tenth generation, shall ever enter the assembly of the LORD,
Deu 23:4 because they did not meet you with food and water on the way when you came out of Egypt, and because they hired against you Balaam the son of Beor from Pethor of Mesopotamia, to curse you.

However, you want to a phrase in Ezra and override Deuteronomy 23:4 with it. So let's look at Ezra:

Ezr 9:1 Now when these things had been completed, the princes approached me, saying, "The people of Israel and the priests and the Levites have not separated themselves from the peoples of the lands, according to their abominations, those of the Canaanites, the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Jebusites, the Ammonites, the Moabites, the Egyptians and the Amorites.
Ezr 9:2 "For they have taken some of their daughters as wives for themselves and for their sons, so that the holy race has intermingled with the peoples of the lands; indeed, the hands of the princes and the rulers have been foremost in this unfaithfulness."

Two things here. First "daughters" are the focus here and the term "Moabites" is used. So your theory about "Moabites" in Deuteronomy 23:3 only meaning men is on shaky ground.

Second, we saw what God's reason was for not marrying Moabites. But there was another reason for the others:

Deu 7:1 "When the LORD your God brings you into the land where you are entering to possess it, and clears away many nations before you, the Hittites and the Girgashites and the Amorites and the Canaanites and the Perizzites and the Hivites and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and stronger than you,
Deu 7:2 and when the LORD your God delivers them before you and you defeat them, then you shall utterly destroy them. You shall make no covenant with them and show no favor to them.
Deu 7:3 "Furthermore, you shall not intermarry with them; you shall not give your daughters to their sons, nor shall you take their daughters for your sons.
Deu 7:4 "For they will turn your sons away from following Me to serve other gods; then the anger of the LORD will be kindled against you and He will quickly destroy you.

Now YOU want to ADD Moabites to THIS section of scripture and disregard God's reason for excluding Moabites in Deuteronomy 23:3.

Do you see what you're doing?

741 posted on 09/11/2007 7:29:45 AM PDT by DouglasKC
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