Posted on 06/20/2007 11:30:39 AM PDT by PAR35
With its pastor citing "25 years of accumulated frustration" with the Presbyterian Church (USA), First Presbyterian Church in Quincy, Ill., has scheduled a congregational vote June 24 on whether to request dismissal from the denomination.
The session made a unanimous recommendation for the resolution at its meeting April 16. The June 24 vote will ask the congregation to resolve to ask Great Rivers Presbytery to dismiss the church to the Evangelical Presbyterian Church.
Bakker said he received a letter two weeks ago from the presbytery stating that if his church is dismissed with its property, the presbytery wants $550,000 in return.
(Excerpt) Read more at layman.org ...
PCUSA ping
It's been know to happen in some presbyteries but they generally end up with an empty building they have to sell, after having significant carrying expenses. The smart ones just opt for the most cash they can squeeze out. A few are gracious about it, and charge only enough to keep Louisville off their backs.
They could always quit the church en masse and leave them with a dead empty building.
I just thought of you - are you still around, or did you go over to the other site?
Aren’t you PCUSA? If so, is your church staying, or is it planning to go to the EPC. (And if I’ve confused you with someone else, my apologies.)
There are usually some older folks who value the woodwork and windows more than they do their faith. Then the Presbytery has to wait for them to die off before it can sell the property.
Yes, there are those. Sad isn’t it.
The June 24 date seems significant. There are at least three PC(USA) congregations in my area holding similar votes on that day. Looks like it was timed to coincide with the EPC GA.
The PCUSA has gone to that well one too many times. The New Winskins churches already prepared for that tactic before they made their move, and have both the resources and strategy to deal with it.
Added to the expense of an empty building, they can cause the denomination massive legal expense, even if they loose. Remember, there are over 260 congregations. That's a lot of trials, and a lot of lawyer fees in a denomination that is ALREADY feeling the financial pinch of declining donations and membership.
No, the EPC General Assembly is going to be too busy to care. It gets scheduled when it gets scheduled. Remember that within BOTH the PCUSA and the EPC, there is a procedure for leaving the denomination. In the EPC, a Congregational meeting is held, and a vote of the congregation is taken. If in favor of Leaving, another congregational meeting is scheduled, with officials from the Presbytery in attendance and having floor privilages. The issue is then debated. After three months, ANOTHER congregational meeting is held for the final vote. If the result of that vote is for leaving, the Presbytery IMMEDIATELY dismisses that congregation...with all assets as per EPC constitution...to either independence, or another denomination.
I think you missed my point. Several PC(USA) churches have scheduled congregation meeting to vote of realignment for June 24. The EPC GA is from June 20-23, which is considering the creation of create “transitional, non-geographic presbyteries” to house all the incoming PC(USA) congregations. The PC(USA) churches voting on June 24 will then have somewhere to go. No further votes by the congregation are required (if I understand PC(USA) polity correctly).
Why wouldn’t they go PCA?
Most of the churches leaving the PCUSA at this point have had women serving as elders for years. It would be too much institutional shock to return to the Biblican standards. The best they can do is the EPC.
Having said that, there is still an occasional church that moves from the PCUSA to the PCA, and one of the more recent splits went from PCUSA to ARP.
All in all, the New Wineskin churches will fit more easily into the EPC.
I’d rather fit into God’s word.
I’m personally more concerned with the liberal drift in some of the urban PCA presbyteries.
Agreed. It’s progress but the next step may be more difficult.
There are some of us who think that the EPC is a PRETTY GOOD STEP. And FYI, the EPC does strive to follow biblical standards...i have refrained from commenting on certain distinctives of the PCA...don't make me regret that choice and repent of it. This thought that the EPC somehow doesn't measure up to the PCA, OPC, RPCNA, or ERPC, is beginning to get tiresome. It could also be argued that those mentioned above don't 'measure up' to the EPC. Keep that in mind.
All in all, the New Wineskin churches will fit more easily into the EPC.
Well, it's not going to be easy for the EPC. There is a lot of baggage that doesn't get spoken of when a congregation changes it's denominational affiliation, let alone a multitude that would more than double the size of the recipient denomination. It will be a very difficult transition for both sides.
As a PCAer, I'd say at this point the PCA doesn't measure up to the ARP or the OPC. But it is pretty clear that the EPC falls short of Biblical standards on ordination.
I figured both the PCA and the EPC probably gained when Cedar Springs switched.
By the way - do you defend EPC's membership in WARC, where you all commune with the likes of the United Church of Christ (can't get much more liberal than that) and the PCUSA? I suppose it does give you all an outlet for "Mobilizing churches to address economic and ecological injustices." and "Education and awareness building to ensure that the impact of the economy on women and young persons is recognized and strengthening their capacity for survival and resistance." as you focus on the "the Justice, Peace and Integrity of Creation initiative of the World Council of Churches." http://warc.jalb.de/warcajsp/side.jsp?news_id=796&part_id=28&navi=24 http://warc.jalb.de/warcajsp/church_list2.jsp?navi=9&news_id=311
(Yes, you all are not members of the WCC, but you all apparently advance their goals through WARC).
Perhaps not. While female ordination is permitted in the EPC, there are only a handful of female teaching elders at the moment, and many churches have only male ruling elders. So it may be that while currently ordained women will continue in their roles, the practice will gradually decline.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.