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To: Diego1618; fortheDeclaration; Ping-Pong; Thinkin' Gal; DouglasKC; Uncle Chip; Quix; ...
Here is Moses being told the real name of The Lord. Even Abraham, Isaac and Jacob did not know it....and a heathen Moabitess women would not have known it either. It was God's name given to the Israelites and Ruth happened to be one of them!

Ruth the Moabitess could have learned the name of God from Mahlon or Naomi.

You say that God does not distinguish between “Israelite” and “Moabite.” Scripture refers to Ruth as a Moabite at least six times. God is not careless.

Then you come down on the translators, they didn’t know any better. Somehow they translated the word for judge rightly in Ruth 1:1 but missed it in verse 17.

Do you actually think that Our Lord had a Heathen Moabite in his lineage when God went out of his way to kill the heathen sons of Judah in [Genesis 38:1-10] to prevent just that from happening?

Yes I do. This may be something you have overlooked, you see, if Ruth had bee an Israelite, then the nearer kinsman would have been free to perform the part of a kinsman without marring his inheritance.

How do you account for the typical meaning in the book of Ruth if the nearer kinsman represents the “law” and Boaz represents Grace?”

Seven
121 posted on 07/23/2007 11:27:45 PM PDT by Seven_0 (You cannot fool all of the people, ever!)
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To: Seven_0; Diego1618
How do you account for the typical meaning in the book of Ruth if the nearer kinsman represents the “law” and Boaz represents Grace?”

Diego never heard of the word Grace.

The Strong's definition of it really means....

123 posted on 07/23/2007 11:43:40 PM PDT by fortheDeclaration (We must beat the Democrats or the country will be ruined! - Lincoln)
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To: Seven_0; Diego1618
[Here is Moses being told the real name of The Lord. Even Abraham, Isaac and Jacob did not know it....and a heathen Moabitess women would not have known it either. It was God's name given to the Israelites and Ruth happened to be one of them! ]

Ruth the Moabitess could have learned the name of God from Mahlon or Naomi.

Gee, you think that is possible?

They were only dwelling in the land for 10 years! (Ru.1:4)

124 posted on 07/23/2007 11:48:53 PM PDT by fortheDeclaration (We must beat the Democrats or the country will be ruined! - Lincoln)
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To: Seven_0; Ping-Pong; Uncle Chip; William Terrell; DouglasKC; Thinkin' Gal
Ruth the Moabitess could have learned the name of God from Mahlon or Naomi.

Yes...this is true, but Samuel would not have recorded her using this word if she was not an Israelite.

[Deuteronomy 23:3] An Ammonite or Moabite shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to their tenth generation shall they not enter into the congregation of the LORD for ever. Mahlon and Naomi would have been very aware of this admonition from the Lord.

You say that God does not distinguish between “Israelite” and “Moabite.” Scripture refers to Ruth as a Moabite at least six times.

Ruth can be called a Woman of Moab the same way an Englishman being born and living in Australia can then be called an Australian. The key point I made in my post was when Boaz asked of his servant, "Whose damsel is this?" and was told, "It is the Moabitish damsel that came back with Naomi out of "The Country of Moab". The Country of Moab was not The Kingdom of Moab. It was the plains of Moab and the Israelites controlled that area until they were taken to Assyria in 721 B.C. I showed the Hebrew word used in scripture to denote that area and it was not Heathen Moab. The simple fact is: Ruth was a woman of Moab....the same way my wife is a woman of California....but Mexico and Spain used to own California! My wife is not Mexican nor is she Spanish! And Ruth was an Israelite!

I think folks need to understand something here....the time in history is about 1100 B.C. and the Israelites have already been in Moab a few hundred years. Moses gave this land to Gad and Rueben before he died [Numbers 32:20-22]. He died in 1405 B.C. (it is estimated). So....the Israelites controlled this area, The Plains of Moab, east of Jericho and the River Jordan from Gilead in the North to The River Arnon in the south for about 700 years.

I asked in my first post(#117), "Why would Naomi and family really want to go to the Heathen Moab" below the River Arnon. They would have absolutely no reason. Their Brother tribes controlled this vast agricultural plain and since there was famine in Judah this would have been a natural destination for many of them.

Then you come down on the translators, they didn't know any better. Somehow they translated the word for judge rightly in Ruth 1:1 but missed it in verse 17.

Here is the first word....[Ruth 1:1] Translated "Judges" in the KJV: Strong's #8199. shaphat (shaw-fat')a primitive root; to judge, i.e. pronounce sentence (for or against); by implication, to vindicate or punish; by extenssion, to govern; passively, to litigate (literally or figuratively)+ avenge, X that condemn, contend, defend, execute (judgment), (be a) judge(-ment), X needs, plead, reason, rule.

Here is the second word...[Ruth 1:15-16] Translated "God" in the KJV: Strong's #430 'elohiym (el-o-heem')gods in the ordinary sense; but specifically used (in the plural thus, especially with the article) of the supreme God; occasionally applied by way of deference to magistrates; and sometimes as a superlative; angels, X exceeding, God (gods)(-dess, -ly), X (very) great, judges, X mighty.

Two different words....but similar meaning and they certainly make sense with what we know about Ruth and this area of Moab......during the time of the Judges (verse 1). I guess the question you need to really ask yourself is: Why did the translators use the plural for "gods" in verse 15 but then use the singular for the same word in verse 16? The Hebrew word Elohim is a uni plural noun and would certainly not be used to describe our Lord. The translators erred!

The word translated The "Lord" in verse 17 is the true name for God and one has to ask.....why didn't Ruth use this word in verse 16 when she was ostensibly telling Naomi, "and thy God my God"? The answer to that question is this. She wasn't talking about God.....she was talking about the Judges!

[Ruth 1:17] Where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried: the LORD do so to me, and more also, if ought but death part thee and me.

Strong's #3068. Yhovah (yeh-ho-vaw')the) self-Existent or Eternal; Jehovah, Jewish national name of God. This is the word she used in verse 17 but did not use in verse 16.

Everyone look at your maps in the backs of your Bibles for the location of the tribes after Moses. You will see that the Israelite territory of Moab (Gad and Rueben) is about three times as large as the Kingdom of Moab.

You are expecting me to believe that Ruth was a descendant of folks who really were not in God's favor...and to agree with translators who obviously were wrong...that Naomi and family went to live in hostile territory for ten years without an incident...intermarry with them and come back to Judah with a daughter of this Heathen Nation....and receive a royal welcome by the entire population of the land....and have her hailed as an equal to Rachel and Leah! It's touchy feely....but not scriptural.

[Ezra 9:1-2] Now when these things were done, the princes came to me, saying, The people of Israel, and the priests, and the Levites, have not separated themselves from the people of the lands, doing according to their abominations, even of the Canaanites, the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Jebusites, the Ammonites, the Moabites, the Egyptians, and the Amorites. 2 For they have taken of their daughters for themselves, and for their sons: so that the holy seed have mingled themselves with the people of those lands: yea, the hand of the princes and rulers hath been chief in this trespass.

After the return from Babylon (525 B.C.) the admonition from Our Lord [Deuteronomy 23:3] was still in effect.....600 years later!

132 posted on 07/24/2007 5:07:52 PM PDT by Diego1618
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