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To: Diego1618
What then, would be your response to Paul? [Galatians 2:7]

Rom 1:13-16 -- Paul seems to say he'd like to work with ALL the Christians in Rome, not just the gentile ones. Things moved quickly in the decades after the Resurrection.

Sorry, I am not going to work that way with you.

You have put a unique and controversial proposition under examination. You claim that your research and study show that the vast majority of Christians are just as wrong as can be about the early church, and that MY church especially is actually made up of followers of a bogus Apostle who was actually a gnostic magician or somesuch, and is wrong aboute nearly everything, from t he day of the week on which we worship on down.

As just ONE example, to support your argument you make a claim about the word Ethnos, which seems to involve an unexplicable misreading of what Strong says, and for which I can find no other scholarly confirmation.

Your interpretation of Strong's entry on Ethnos calls into question everything you say. I, personally, feel suckered because I hobbled over to THIS bookcase for my Youngs, to THAT one for my Bauer Arndt and Gingrich, to yet another to find Kittel. Then I pushed a temporary bookcase over to where I can reach it from my bed of alleged pain, and made sure I could get a couple of translations of Scripture and had my Greek Testament nearby.

Then I hacked my way through the research and find that there just isn't support in my materials for what you assert. It was a wild goose chase!

All that work to learnI was right all along! What a PAIN! And now you want me to go research something else?

I think that the Great Commission is still plausibly understood as a commission to go to the Gentiles and that the construction of it as a commissioning to the Diaspora only is not born out linguistically nor any other way. The rules of the game have changed radically. I think Acts portrays Paul as going to the diaspora and going first to Synagogues and then to Gentiles. I think the writings of Paul indicate that "in Christ there is neither Jew nor Greek, (and so forth)", that, in other words as the meaning of the Resurrection sunk in, and as the situation changed (and lots and lots of Jews converted), the Church distinguished less and less between Jewish Christians and Gentile Christians.

To say that the church's interpretation is invalid, you have to make a positive argument that the Church is invalid. But to make that argument you have to chip at the Church's interpretation. That's circular. You tried to break the circle with the ethnos word study, but that just couldn't make the case.

I'd suggest making your case in a straight-forward manner.

1,762 posted on 03/12/2007 4:58:26 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Now we are all Massoud)
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To: Mad Dawg
Rom 1:13-16 -- Paul seems to say he'd like to work with ALL the Christians in Rome, not just the gentile ones. Things moved quickly in the decades after the Resurrection.

[Romans 1:13-16] Now I would not have you ignorant, brethren, that oftentimes I purposed to come unto you, (but was let hitherto,) that I might have some fruit among you also, even as among other Gentiles. I am debtor both to the Greeks, and to the Barbarians; both to the wise, and to the unwise. So, as much as in me is, I am ready to preach the gospel to you that are at Rome also. For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

Yes, you are correct. Christianity spread like wildfire after Pentecost and Churches sprang up all over the civilized world as the Gospel spread from brother to uncle to grandmother to niece to neighbor to friend to acquaintance to employee to stranger to child....all without the benefit of clergy or Apostleship.

Paul wrote these words (Romans 1) about 56 A.D., probably from Corinth. He had not yet been to Rome and he speaks of his disappointment in not being able to visit. He does not address Peter nor make mention of him.

In [Acts 28:21-22] Paul is speaking to the assembled Jewish leaders of Rome. He is under house arrest after being forcefully brought to Rome from Jerusalem. It is now about 61/62 A.D. (five or six years later) and the Jewish leaders say "And they said unto him, We neither received letters out of Judaea concerning thee, neither any of the brethren that came shewed or spake any harm of thee. But we desire to hear of thee what thou thinkest: for as concerning this sect, we know that every where it is spoken against."

On the surface....wouldn't you consider this train of events odd if Peter, commissioned as the Jewish Evangelizer [Galatians 2:7], had been in and about Rome for the last 20/25 years or so....according to your tradition? Paul, being an Evangelizer to both Gentile and Jew, was able to deal with these folks as well as the Gentile Population.

As just ONE example, to support your argument you make a claim about the word Ethnos, which seems to involve an unexplicable misreading of what Strong says, and for which I can find no other scholarly confirmation.

Are you saying that the word "Ethnos" cannot mean Tribe, Nation or People? Are you saying that it must in all cases mean Gentile?

I, personally, feel suckered because I hobbled over to THIS bookcase for my Youngs, to THAT one for my Bauer Arndt and Gingrich, to yet another to find Kittel. Then I pushed a temporary bookcase over to where I can reach it from my bed of alleged pain, and made sure I could get a couple of translations of Scripture and had my Greek Testament nearby.

I am sorry for your discomfort and pain. I shall refrain from posting to you regarding these questions until you have recuperated.

1,765 posted on 03/12/2007 5:47:08 PM PDT by Diego1618
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