[Alex Murphy]

...with the proper intention.

What precisely is "the proper intention" when it comes to non-Catholic baptisms?

Almost a year ago, Catholic FReeper Campion and I discussed "validity" in regards to the Eucharist and Presbyterians. I would imagine that the same rules apply re baptism?

Well, Alex, since, e.g., Presbyterians reject apostolic succession, reject the idea of the priesthood per se, and reject transubstantiation or anything close to it, there's really not much chance of a Presbyterian Eucharist being a valid Catholic sacrament. Sacramental validity requires a valid minister, valid matter (bread made from wheat only, wine mixed with water), valid "form" (the words that are said, and valid intent (the intent to do what the Catholic church does). Unless your Presbyterian minister is a former Catholic or Orthodox (or perhaps Anglican) priest, he's not a validly ordained minister. He probably doesn't have a valid intent, either.

[Campion]

I would imagine that the same rules apply re baptism?

Haven't we already done this discussion?

For baptism:

• valid minister == anyone
• valid matter == water, administered by immersion or pouring (certainly) or sprinkling (maybe a problem)
• valid form == something like "N., I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Holy Trinity" The Trinity must be invoked.
• valid intent == the "intent to do what the Church does," that is, to administer Christian baptism in the name of the Trinity

Most conservative Protestant denominations meet all four requirements. (Some may baptize by sprinking, which may be an issue.)

Liberal Protestants who do stuff like baptizing in the name of the "Creator, Redeemer, and Sanctifier" may not be administering valid baptism, however. Mormon and JW baptisms are invalid because they reject the Trinity.

[sitetest]

Dear Alex Murphy,

Proper intention is intend to do what the Church does. In the case of baptism, it is the intention to baptize.

"Almost a year ago, Catholic FReeper Campion and I discussed 'validity' in regards to the Eucharist and Presbyterians. I would imagine that the same rules apply re baptism?"

Yes and no. The same general principles apply, but the details are significantly different.

"Sacramental validity requires a valid minister,..."

To confect the Eucharist requires an ordained priest. Only the ordained priest is the valid minister of the Eucharist.

On the other hand, any human being may be the valid minister of baptism (at least in the Latin Rite).

Hope that helps.


sitetest