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To: livius; Kolokotronis
The Lutheran Reformation has less similarity to islam than some of the more radical and Reformed strains do. But remember this, the biggest common factor between the two are iconoclasm. Lutherans, for the most part, didn't do that. Neither did the Anglicans.

It is pretty easy to set up straw men, harder to take a look closely at things.

What is funny to me, is I used to lurk and the Catholic Answers forum. At least until there were a number of threads where a poster was saying that islam and Roman Catholicism were a lot closer than any Protestant, and most of the posters agreed. Many said that since islam has a better view of Mary than most "protestants", they were closer to being "Christian". Now that is balderdash, but if I wanted to start throwing mud on this issue, it would be very easy to spin it the other way.
111 posted on 02/18/2007 6:35:07 AM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: redgolum; livius

"Many said that since islam has a better view of Mary than most "protestants", they were closer to being "Christian". Now that is balderdash, but if I wanted to start throwing mud on this issue, it would be very easy to spin it the other way."

You stumbled across an interesting theological comment which points to an equally interesting religious phenomenon which is seen in Lebanon, Syria and the Holy Land. Alawites and some Shia have a profound devotion to the Theotokos. There are Marian shrines throughout the region where Mohammedans pray right along side Orthodox Christians for her intervention. It is of course, from a Sunni Mohammedan pov, syncretism of the highest order, but there it is. I know Lebanese Orthodox Christians who say that many Shia are "almost Christians" because of this and the Alawites are, derisively, called "Little Christians" by the Sunnis.

I don't think you could spin this the other way with any success even if you wanted to. These pieces of ancient Christianity which persist among the Mohammedans of that region are clearly relics of the Orthodox past of their ancestors. It is not an indication that Christianity learned Marian devotion from the Mohammedans. The timeline is all wrong. In this sense its like the comment once made to me by a WS Lutheran priest who attended one of our Lenten devotions during which we say the Prayer of +Ephraim the Syrian. That prayer involves full body prostrations. He said that we must have picked that up from the Mohammedans. Well, we do look like a bunch of Mohammedans when we say that prayer, but they got it from us, not the other way around.


112 posted on 02/18/2007 6:51:58 AM PST by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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