Don't be too sure of that. I seem to remember a documentary about the Black Plague where there were mistakes made.
Posted on 01/29/2007 6:45:51 AM PST by stfassisi
Your not familiar with the "beast" of the Revelation?
Revelation 13:13-14,/b>
13 He performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men. 14 And he deceives those[e] who dwell on the earth by those signs which he was granted to do in the sight of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who was wounded by the sword and lived.
I've been blessed, too!
Given that I am male, you can imagine my shock to discover that I, too, am mother to the Deity!
But are you not familiar with the Scripture in which Jesus is challenged, when he performs his healings and exorcisms, with using Satan to cast out Satan?
Are you unfamiliar with Jesus' response?
One would gather from this that there is something in the healing function which differs from other signs.
Am humbled and blessed by your kind words.
And peace also with you.
Feel free to comment on this thread about WORSHIP:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/1776357/posts?page=1
You missed Mary Queen of Kernels!
I was rather proud of that one :(
Do they have a dashboard bobblehead? I love those things!
You're assuming I buy into the idea that people have been healed there. I give it the same level of skepticism that I do Benny Hinn's healings.
My post was simply to point out that the Bible mentions at least one evil character capable of performing miracles.
Incidentally, the magicians of Pharaoh may have performed miracles, too.
I've heard the same said of many of those who've gone through near death experiences. I think God knows our hearts better than we know them ourselves, so the real healings that have taken place have less to do with physical wellness & more to do with people seeing their natural human doubts removed.
They think they've been touched by God, and they believe and become more faithful.
I'd use the phrase "firm believers" where you used the term "faithful" & I think all of us are touched by God.
Even folks who go on pilgrimage there who are NOT healed generally report a renewed faith (not everybody).
I see some healings you don't seem to recognize...
Good point.
Scripture does, BTW mention one miracle of satan . . . the AntiChrist being wounded, killed and coming back to life . . . or is it his false prophet.
I don't think that's a miracle performed by him. Even he is part of God's plan.
From the actual reports by the physicians who examined the body:
"The coffin was opened in the presence of the Bishop of Nevers, the mayor of the town, his principal deputy, several canons and ourselves. We noticed no smell. The body was clothed in the habit of Bernadette's order. The habit was damp. Only the face, hands and forearms were uncovered."
"The head was tilted to the left. The face was dull white. The skin clung to the muscles and the muscles adhered to the bones. The eye sockets were covered by the eyelids. The brows were flat on the skin and stuck to the arches above the eyes. The lashes of the right eyelid were stuck to the skin. The nose was dilated and shrunken. The mouth was open slightly and it could be seen that the teeth were still in place. The hands, which were crossed on her breast, were perfectly preserved, as were the nails. The hands still held a rusting rosary. The veins on the forearms stood out."
"Like the hands, the feet were wizened and the toenails were still intact (one of them was torn off when the corpse was washed). When the habits had been removed and the veil lifted from the head, the whole of the shriveled body could be seen, rigid and taut in every limb. It was found that the hair, which had been cut short, was stuck to the head and still attached to the skull, that the ears were in a state of perfect preservation, that the left side of the body was slightly higher than the right from the hip up. The stomach had caved in and was taut like the rest of the body. It sounded like cardboard when struck. The left knee was not as large as the right. The ribs protruded as did the muscles in the limbs."
"So rigid was the body that it could be rolled over and back for washing. The lower parts of the body had turned slightly black. This seems to have been the result of the carbon of which quite large quantities were found in the coffin."
- In witness of which we have duly drawn up this present statement in which all is truthfully recorded. Nevers, September 22, 1909, Drs. Ch. David, A. Jourdan.
"When the coffin was opened the body appeared to be absolutely intact and odorless." (Dr. Talon was more specific: "There was no smell of putrefaction and none of those present experienced any discomfort.") The body is practically mummified, covered with patches of mildew and quite a notable layer of salts, which appear to be calcium salts. The skeleton is complete, and it was possible to carry the body to a table without any trouble. The skin has disappeared in some places, but it is still present on most parts of the body. Some of the veins are still visible."
At the request of the Bishop of Nevers I detached and removed the rear section of the fifth and sixth right ribs as relics; I noted that there was a resistant, hard mass in the thorax, which was the liver covered by the diaphragm. I also took a piece of the diaphragm and the liver beneath it as relics, and can affirm that this organ was in a remarkable state of preservation. I also removed the two patella bones to which the skin clung and which were covered with more clinging calcium matter. Finally, I removed the muscle fragments right and left from the outsides of the thighs. These muscles were also in a very good state of preservation and did not seem to have putrefied at all."
"From this examination I conclude that the body of the Venerable Bernadette is intact, the skeleton is complete, the muscles have atrophied, but are well preserved; only the skin, which has shriveled, seems to have suffered from the effects of the damp in the coffin. It has taken on a grayish tinge and is covered with patches of mildew and quite a large number of crystals and calcium salts, but the body does not seem to have putrefied, nor has any decomposition of the cadaver set in, although this would be expected and normal after such a long period in a vault hollowed out of the earth."
- Nevers, April 3, 1919, Dr. Comte
"I would have liked to open the left side of the thorax to take the ribs as relics and then remove the heart which I am certain must have survived. However, as the trunk was slightly supported on the left arm, it would have been rather difficult to try and get at the heart without doing too much noticeable damage. As the Mother Superior had expressed a desire for the Saint's heart to be kept together with the whole body, and as Monsignor the Bishop did not insist, I gave up the idea of opening the left-hand side of the thorax and contented myself with removing the two right ribs which were more accessible."
"What struck me during this examination, of course, was the state of perfect preservation of the skeleton, the fibrous tissues of the muscles (still supple and firm), of the ligaments, and of the skin, and above all the totally unexpected state of the liver after 46 years. One would have thought that this organ, which is basically soft and inclined to crumble, would have decomposed very rapidly or would have hardened to a chalky consistency. Yet, when it was cut it was soft and almost normal in consistency. I pointed this out to those present, remarking that this did not seem to be a natural phenomenon."
- Doctor Comte, 1928 Report
http://www.catholicpilgrims.com/lourdes/bb_bernadette_body.htm
Still no response on the emnity that God promised in Genesis.
I'll do my best to research it for you, but if I had to guess I would say it probably doesn't touch on it in much detail. There is a passage on salvation outside the Catholic Church, and this passage is a quote by PPius X, and as far as I can tell, you would have to know that the Catholic church was the one true church and reject it all the same. But the question that arises immediately is who would do that, so it leaves one with the impression that the question is a very open one. Stating the obvious here but 1952 isn't 1552, things change.
NDE's are key.
There are already four published peer-reviewed, controlled, long-term medical hospital studies of near-death experiences.
All four produced statistically similar results.
The experiences described by the control group in all four studies were very similar as to order and content.
There are other individual cases which are quite striking.
Essentially, the science, read in totality, strongly indicates the existence of a detachable consciousness which continues for at least some time after clinical and even brain death in about 20% of people (the rest report no memories, which might mean they had no such experiences, or it might mean that they did and don't remember them or don't want to talk about them).
And then there are those people who were not clinically dead but who have had direct encounters with divine beings, angels, spirits, etc.
The world is a strange place, both physical and spiritual. We understand some aspects of the physical world, but the spiritual world we can't even figure out how to test. So, all we have there is anecdotal evidence and (competing) revelations.
And, of course, even with the same tradition (e.g.: Christianity) there are passionate, even violent, differences of opinion over the MEANING of revelation, let alone the authenticity of it (voir this thread, for instance).
There are plenty of mysteries at the junctures of good and evil.
I feel that I don't KNOW enough to assert that 100% of all evil maneuvers are 100% magical parlor illusions, tricks.
Was it so with the magicians in Pharoah's court in front of Moses?
Or were the evil spirits manipulating matter and animals merely--rather totally--inferior to Holy Spirit through and around Moses?
Perhaps it is sometimes more the former and sometimes more the latter.
In any case, what Believers are to have to do with is HOLY SPIRIT and
absolutely 100% NONE to do with are substitutes--especially of a witchcraft sort.
Well put.
"I suppose I could pick the partially germinated barely off the ground"
After seeing how most of us looked at the recent gathering of the Hartford freepers I would just as soon have someone clothed when they picked the partially germinated barley off the ground. Just my sensitivity and queezy stomach.
Don't be too sure of that. I seem to remember a documentary about the Black Plague where there were mistakes made.
"Have you ever tried to milk a cat?"
Man!, you guys are something else. Here I am trying my hardest to keep this a serious thread and just look at you. By the way, some tribes in Africa drink lion's milk as kind of a passage thing, but you have to be fast....really fast and carry a big stick....preferably one that shoots big bullets.
Milking a lion.
Jeepers.
That sounds like a good way to die.
So does milking a Rhinocerous.
"That sounds like a good way to die."
Now that you mention it I didn't notice many men in the pictures in article. Seems to me it was a matriarchal society and it was the women who started that rite of passage for the males. I think we had better keep an eye out for any female politician who preaches "It takes a Village".
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