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To: stfassisi

So much good and true in this piece!

But then he says this: "If a human being was never able to see with bodily eyes, or hear with bodily ears, or feel with bodily touch, or taste with bodily tongue, or smell with bodily nostrils - that person would never have a single thought. All our knowledge derives from our bodily powers."

And he repeats it too: "Our minds, I repeat, are only potentially knowledgeable before they acquire knowledge and then potentially knowing when they do not attend to the knowledge they have acquired. The knowledge of angels does not depend on sense experience."

It is unfortunate because, though repeated twice, it's not true. We do know things even without sense. Many things. It would be better and truer to say that we ourselves are angels entombed in flesh, and limited by flesh, but that when our spirits are freed of flesh, at death, we see beyond the limitations of the flesh.

This is why the congenitally blind, who have never seen in their lives and who do not see in any of their dreams, nevertheless see clearly and reported fully sighted experiences (and confusion over color) in those cases in which a congenitally blind person has had a traumatic accident, clinically died, and been medically rescuscitated.
They have no memories of sight, and no knowledge of what they see, and yet they DO see when they leave their bodies.

It should never be said that our minds and our thoughts originate completely in our senses. It is false, and demonstrably so.

It would be better to say that we are angels dipped into flesh for a time, and limited by the flesh, for God's inscrutable purposes. That is far closer to the truth, and may perhaps even be the LITERAL truth, depending the extent to which a soul that has left its body is in the same condition and has the same abilities as an angel.

However, to the exxtent that the angels, or the greatest among them, were created at the dawn of existence, that is not so of us. Those blind who see in their death experiences before rescuscitation return with memories of sight, and are forever after as the formerly sighted as opposed to congenitally blind who have never seen. BUT they do not report memories spanning back to the beginning of time, or indeed spanning before their term of years. From this, we have evidence that we really do come into being at some point around our conception, and are not pre-existing beings waiting in heaven for our chance to take a dip in flesh.

There is plenty of good data about these things that allow us to move past speculation or reliance on pure revelation.

Anyway, interesting topic. Thank you.

3 posted on 01/12/2007 3:40:48 PM PST by Vicomte13 (Aure entuluva.)
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To: Vicomte13
Dear Friend, thank for responding,but We humans can NOT ever become a true angel.
Saint Thomas Aquinas was an Angelic doctor on the history of angels.
here is a link to his writings.(you will need to scroll down to the Angel section)

Objection 6. Further, to beget offspring is a vital act. But this has befallen the angels in their assumed bodies; for it is related: "After the sons of God went in to the daughters of men, and they brought forth children, these are the mighty men of old, men of renown" (Genesis 6:4). Consequently the angels exercised vital functions in their assumed bodies.

On the contrary, The bodies assumed by angels have no life, as was stated in the previous article (ad 3). Therefore they cannot exercise functions of life through assumed bodies.

I answer that, Some functions of living subjects have something in common with other operations; just as speech, which is the function of a living creature, agrees with other sounds of inanimate things, in so far as it is sound; and walking agrees with other movements, in so far as it is movement. Consequently vital functions can be performed in assumed bodies by the angels, as to that which is common in such operations; but not as to that which is special to living subjects; because, according to the Philosopher (De Somn. et Vig. i), "that which has the faculty has the action." Hence nothing can have a function of life except what has life, which is the potential principle of such action.

Peace In Christ
4 posted on 01/12/2007 5:37:19 PM PST by stfassisi ("Above all gifts that Christ gives his beloved is that of overcoming self"St Francis Assisi)
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