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To: kosta50; annalex; Forest Keeper; Kolokotronis; kawaii; xzins; Blogger; wmfights; HarleyD; ...
"comes from the so-called 'apocrypha,' the books that were apparently credible to the Apostles who wrote the NT, and to the Church Fathers who put together the Chirstian canon (including the 'apocryphal' books)"

None of the apochrypal books are included in the Hebrew Canon. Jesus authenticated the Hebrew Canon when He said "all things must be fulfilled which were written in the 'Law of Moses, the Prophets (these included the historical books) and the psalms'concerning Himself " (Luke 24:44). The Hebrew Canon was already fixed without the apocrypha during the time of Christ. Josephus who wrote shortly after the time of Christ said that the last of the sacred books was written during the time of Artaxerxes, King of Persia. These would be Ezra and Nehemiah.

Josephus said "Although so great a time interval has now passed, not a soul has ventured to add or remove or to alter a syllable, and it is the instinct of every Jew, from the day of his birth, to consider these Scriptures as the teaching of God, to abide by them, and, if need be, to cheerfully lay down his life in their behalf." His enumeration and description of these books show that they were the same as those of the Old Testament as we now have it.

The apocryphal books were added to the Septuagint, the Greek translation of the Hebrew Scriptures, but they were never accepted as part of the Hebrew Canon and although there are allusions to it in some of the New Testament writings they are never quoted as authentic as are the references to the Old Testament. Those able to read Hebrew rejected the Septuagint and it became a source of intense conflict between the Hebrew speaking religious and the Aramaic/Greek speaking Jews. Early church fathers such as Origen, Rufinus and Augustine made a distinction between the Hebrew Canon and the apocryphal books. In the early church the Septuagint became the source for excluding the Jewishness of the early church.

During the time of the apostles, most of the books of the New Testament were quoted by the early church writers. Clement of Rome referred to 1 Corinthians as "Paul's epistle". Papias assigned to Matthew and Mark the Gospels that bear their name. Tertullian and Irenaeus regarded the four Gospels and most of the books of the New Testament as genuine. Eusebius of Caesarea (circa 315 A.D.) declared in his "Ecclestical History" that it was universally admitted that the following are genuine: the four Gospels, the Acts of the Apostles, the fourteen Epistles of Paul, including Hebrews, The First Epistles of John and Peter, and the Revelation of John. The canon catalogue of Origen (circa 225 A.D.) is precisely the same as Eusebius.

In the fourth century there were 10 catalogues of the canon; six in which all the books of the present New Testament were regarded as canonical (Augustine, Jerome, Rufinus, the Council of Carthage, Epiphanius, Athanasius); three which omitted only the book of Revelation (Gregory Nazianzen, the Council of Laodicea, Cyril of Jerusalem); one catalogue of Philaster omitted the Epistle to the Hebrews and Revelation.

The apocryphal books were included as part of the Old Testament Canon by the Council of Trent in 1546 A.D.
9,009 posted on 02/05/2007 6:42:59 PM PST by blue-duncan
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To: blue-duncan; annalex; Forest Keeper; Kolokotronis; kawaii; xzins; wmfights; HarleyD
None of the apochrypal books are included in the Hebrew Canon

The Hebrew canon is irrelevant. The Apostles used Septuagint as reference in over 90% of the cases.

Josephus ...

Josephus was not a Christian, but a Pharisee. As such he would not be using Christian sources.

Early church fathers such as Origen, Rufinus and Augustine made a distinction between the Hebrew Canon and the apocryphal books

Origen was not a Church Father. Eusebius was hardly a reliable source. +Jerome included the deuterocanonical books in the Vulgate.

The Eastern Church used the deuterocanonical books because that's what was passed on from the beginning.

The rabbis at Jamnia (100 AD) threw out not only the deuterocanonical books but the NT books as well.

9,022 posted on 02/05/2007 8:26:33 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: blue-duncan; kosta50; Forest Keeper; Kolokotronis; kawaii; xzins; Blogger; wmfights; HarleyD
The apocryphal books were added to the Septuagint, the Greek translation of the Hebrew Scriptures, but they were never accepted as part of the Hebrew Canon

Like I said, I happen to be Christian and I am only interested in the Christian Canon, as established East and West by the Church. I also have little respect for those who edit the Word of God to suit their theological fantasies.

9,110 posted on 02/06/2007 11:59:42 AM PST by annalex
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