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To: Forest Keeper; wmfights; Quix; Kolokotronis; klossg; HarleyD; Dr. Eckleburg; Gamecock
There is such a thing as a "conditional" gift. For example, a man gives a woman an engagement ring

Well, if you want to consider it a "gift," that's fine. I could say it's something else, but I'll leave it at that. This doesn't change the definition of the word, gift. I will not quote dictionaries on this. The meaning is self-evident. A gift must be free to be a gift.

when WM speaks of the "free gift" of grace, he makes a legitimate distinction because God does not give us that grace with any expectation of performance of anything from ourselves The phrase "free gift" used biblically comes from KJV. It does not exist in the Greek original. It is yet another example of "alternative" reading of the Bible and assuming that it was there all along.

The word used is actually charisma. If anything, undeserved mercy is a closer translation. As such, I am not sure it is unconditional. God pardons us, but with a caveat.

8,644 posted on 02/02/2007 2:37:53 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50; wmfights; Quix; Kolokotronis; klossg; HarleyD; Dr. Eckleburg; Gamecock
The phrase "free gift" used biblically comes from KJV. It does not exist in the Greek original. It is yet another example of "alternative" reading of the Bible and assuming that it was there all along.

The word used is actually charisma. If anything, undeserved mercy is a closer translation. As such, I am not sure it is unconditional. God pardons us, but with a caveat.

While I did not find the two words "free gift" together so much, I did find the word "gift" all over the place in the Douay-Rheims, and in the correct context. For example:

Eph. 2:8 : 8 For by grace you are saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, for it is the gift of God; ... DR

So, if gift means free gift, and I think we agree that it does, then how could this be an invention of the KJV?

9,664 posted on 02/07/2007 4:55:48 PM PST by Forest Keeper
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