[adiaireton8]

It is my understanding that the "he" (of Gen 3:15) refers to Christ. But we have to remember that the word "seed" [zara`] in Hebrew has multiple senses. It can mean semen, and it can mean offspring (i.e. descendents). In Gen 3:15, it is referring to offspring. In post #532, when kosta50 says "there was no seed", I think he means that there was no semen present when Mary conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit. The phrase "If a woman have conceived seed" is a misleading translation of Lev 12:1. It means "When a woman produces seed [i.e. offspring] and bears [begets, brings forth] a child ..."

-A8

[kosta50]

A8, the Greek term sperma has multiple meanings as well, just as zara does in Hebrew, including semen and offspring.

I don't see "he" in that same verse as Christ. The Septuagint doesn't even say "he" but "you." And it says "watch" (as in "guard"), not bruise or crush.

You are correct (re:#532), there was no "seed" (i.e. sperma), which is why I am wondering why Luke uses the same term for conception as he does for Elizabeth (who did conceive carnally), while John disctintly uses the word "beget."

My point was that the Incarnation was not a "natural" pregnancy, nor can it be thought as "natural" conception lest it be distorted into one, which would lead to a distorted and inconsistent conclusion that Mary gave birth "naturally" (vaginally).

The earliest documents showing that the Church believed in Virginal Birth (i.e. the birth canal was closed, the hymen was preserved) dates to St. Justin Martyr (mid 2nd century). That doesn't mean that it is the earliest.