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To: Alamo-Girl; hosepipe; wmfights; betty boop; .30Carbine; cornelis; Dr. Eckleburg; P-Marlowe
if anyone - anyone - ever was good enough ("works") to get into heaven then Christ died for nothing.

This does not follow. Christ died so that your works may have the fruit of salvation. Without Him, they would be dead, see Romans 3-5. With Him, they brign you to the finish line:

24 Know you not that they that run in the race, all run indeed, but one receiveth the prize? So run that you may obtain. 25 And every one that striveth for the mastery, refraineth himself from all things: and they indeed that they may receive a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible one. 26 I therefore so run, not as at an uncertainty: I so fight, not as one beating the air: 27 But I chastise my body, and bring it into subjection: lest perhaps, when I have preached to others, I myself should become a castaway.

(1 Corinthians 9)


6,937 posted on 01/19/2007 11:12:47 AM PST by annalex
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To: annalex
Why would anyone prefer to believe they accomplish their own good works when Scripture tells us it is the indwelling Holy Spirit who accomplishes all righteousness on our behalf?

"But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me." -- 1 Corinthians 15:10

"I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me." -- Galatians 2:20

The problem stems from the RC misunderstanding of justification (acquitted once for all the sins of the elect) and sanctification (the ongoing, predestined work of the Holy Spirit to bring the elect to repentance, obedience and faith.)

6,942 posted on 01/19/2007 11:25:15 AM PST by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: annalex; Alamo-Girl; betty boop; .30Carbine
Isaiah 64;6..
All of us have become like one who is unclean,
and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags;
we all shrivel up like a leaf,
and like the wind our sins sweep us away.

Note: on the other hand Jesus died on the cross for Something.. WHAT?..

6,944 posted on 01/19/2007 11:30:17 AM PST by hosepipe (CAUTION: This propaganda is laced with hyperbole....)
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To: annalex; hosepipe; wmfights; betty boop; .30Carbine; cornelis; Dr. Eckleburg; P-Marlowe
To the contrary, Christ and He alone, is necessary for salvation. He, and He alone, is the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

The works we do are evidence that we are saved.

Faith without works is dead (James) - the demons also believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God - and they tremble.

The bottom line, dear annalex, is that Jesus does not say in the Sermon on the Mount to "do" perfect things or to "say" perfect things - but rather, to "be" perfect.

Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. - Matthew 5:48

We are all sinners and have come short of the glory of God - being perfect is not something that we can "do" or "say." But God is perfect (Deu 32). So "being" is about where we choose to live - in His Light or not (epistles of John) - abiding in Him and He in us or not because without Him we can "do" nothing. (John 15)

This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us [our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. - I John 1:5-10 (also John 15)

That also is the difference between Martha and Mary in Luke 10. Martha was cumbered about much serving. She was "doing". Mary was feeding on the Living Word of God, she was "being".

That, my beloved sisters and brothers, is the Spiritual discernment I have received of John 6 - we are to feed on Him, The Living Word of God. That is the meaning of Lord's command, "take, eat, this is my body" and "Drink ye all of it; For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins." (Matt 26)

6,947 posted on 01/19/2007 11:38:52 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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